Detroit TSA Security Theater
Filed under: National, News, Obscured Truth Network, Police, Thuggery, Video
On a recent layover in Detroit, I was filming roaming squads of TSA agents searching passengers at the gates. I didn’t feel like answering their questions, and their response was, well, see for youself . . .
In part 1 I interact with Janetta a TSA “Behavior Detection Officer”
The airport police show up to continue the harassment in part 2:
In part 3 I go on the offensive asking about body scanners, security failures, and more. Check Obscuredtruth.com for part 3 which will be posted soon.
Update: Part 3 will post here when it’s done:
Comments
107 Comments on Detroit TSA Security Theater
Sweet video’s Sam! Thanks for giving us this example of how a bunch of bungling stooges with guns act.
Reminds me of a whole team of Smokey and The Bandit cops…what a bunch of BOOBS.
I love how Sam is detained and can’t move without permission, but is yelled at to get away from the officers.
Also its all the “Citizen’s fault” if everyone stays in line and does what their told, only the criminals will get out of line…right?
Good production value, but if I could make one minor suggestion? Can you take the music down just a hair so it’s easier to hear the dialogue? Either way, nice job and thanks for sharing.
It’s obvious those TSA agents have never met a keeniac before. You can tell because they are confused to meet a person that cares about freedom and does not blindly do as they are told.
Great work Sam. I think a lot of people are just afraid of missing their flights, so they go along with the criminals. Bet you’re on their list now! I think airports are the clearest example of government monopoly gone horribly wrong. I refuse to allow my child into a device that both allows pedophiles to keep pictures and has some pretty horrifying health effects.
I’ve said it before, but I have to say it again. Sam, you are awesome! Great job!
I amazes me how people can’t see that this is playing right into what terrorist want. The TSA is taking this position: “In order to catch a terrorist, we have to become terrorist.” It is very simple for me-If this was a private airline protecting it’s passengers I would have no problems with these tactics because I know I could just switch airlines. But since the TSA is a monopoly, the abuse is disgusting. Thanks for the great video Sam and for revealing the gun in the room.
The lesson here is that they would have quickly thrown you into a locked room and done whatever they wanted to. I am certain live streaming video saved your ass, Sam. It’s like a the holy cross to some nightmare creature; evil shrinks from it with hisses and shrieks.
This needs to go viral.
Wow, this is a fantastic vid! You handle yourself very well under pressure…this is just awesome.
And about the music, the volume was perfect when I watched. I was listening with headphones, dunno if that makes a difference.
Great video
Right On!
My dad, sister and I had a little altercation with the TSA a few months back.
When my dad second guessed them about a procedure, one TSA agent said to the other, “Let’s give him a little education” as they proceeded him to “secondary.”
I had a couple things to say about that after I had already passed through the “checkpoint.”
My sis also had a few things to say, which we made sure everyone heard. Such as welcome to the police state. “Never question authority sheep” and so on. Things escalated.
The TSA kid flagged over his supervisor, and exclaimed to her “They’re talkin’ shit” (referring to us). So, I said “Fo sheezy, I don’t like yo’ bullshit my neezy.” I didn’t realize until this encounter that the TSA spoke ebonics. Apparently, they’re multilingual. Who knew
Well done.
We’re screwed.
Come back when we’ve got our new 3G and Wi-fi-blockers online and see how we get you back.
We’ve also put you on the permanent full-body-cavity search list, and included your mother just for good measure.
Revenge is sweet.
What’s that? Interwhatchanetthingie? Online? Everybody can read this???? Oh cr*p.
(Well done dude. Keep it up.)
An insightful intelligent report. Good work pushing the bounds but not overstepping them or letting emotion get the best of you.
Sam,
You got ‘em like King Kong, I’m glad to call you a friend. Mess with them good people anytime you get the chance. It destroys their so-called “legitimacy” bit-by-bit which brings us closer to a free society.
Also, I am hopeful that you didn’t have to go through their body scanners, as they are dangerous. I was told that they are said to cause cancer and have the horrible ability to literally play havoc to a person’s DNA strands.
I agree with you. Peacefully putting up barriers, and being resistant to unreasonable searches, and exercising speech rights is something everyone should do.
One thing: complaining to security agents about policy is not helpful to anyone.
You might as well complain to the Dunkin’ Donuts cashier that frosted donuts are making people fat. You may be right, but there isn’t a damn thing the cashier can do about it.
The manager-type guy may have been the only person you encountered with enough of a voice to do anything.
Unfortunately the end result in the airport is that the TSA complains about you. The people there will not complain about their policies.
I enjoyed your video and hope it has given people a better understanding of our eroding rights.
Dude you got more balls than I have with the TSA .. I admire what you do It does my heart good to see some younger patriots … It’s gonna be a long road … I have pushed them before but not like you did .
Rhetorical Question :
You don’t think you’re gonna get your Constitution back with out a gunfight .. do ya ?
Let me tell you, it doesn’t just require you to have a camera to get the TSA’s attention. Nor questions! All you have to be is a 68 year old female who has a cane and wheelchair, along with those dangerous laptops to bring them out of the woodwork. The last three times I flew they ran me thru’ the whole gambit. Right down to taking my cane and telling me I had to walk thru’ the scanner on my own. Afterward they also had moved this cane far out of my area, but were upset when I leaned on their bag conveyor for balance and security. Then too, they wanted me to carry my laptop over to replace it in the case that was on another counter being inspected.
After this was all complete, taking nearly a half hour, they released me to an airline employee to take me to the gate. He immediately handed me a card with his name on it and the explanation that tips were not required, but accepted. Rape and pillage all in one area. One stop shopping, if you may.
Due to having a metal plate in my neck I also receive additional examination. The first agent to do so was too damned stupid to believe me when I said it was placed there from the front, including showing her the scar from the surgery. She decided I had to have a necklace on, for whatever reason, and grabbed at my top to pull it down. I pushed her back and held my cane out in defense. This is when her supervisor approached to pass me on. During this, my daughter had been cleared and they tried to order her to move on without me. She refused and when pushed to do so she let them know her mother was covered under the American Disabilities Act and could create a ton of trouble for their lack of respect and knowledge, and extremely poor customer relations. End of that push.
I could go on re: unprofessional behavior by the airline staff on the ground and in the air. Lets just say I will never again fly Delta after my last trip with them. For one, they dropped my laptop on the tarmac and in the process spilled out my medication (for pain). When I told them it must be picked up due to being narcotic they did so, but instead of putting the case back in the laptop bag it was palmed. Then they tried to keep my chair as belonging to them, regardless of the fact it wasn’t marked as theirs. I asked if it made it to luggage and was informed no one knew, but if it was missing on the other end to file a complaint to have it replaced. In flight they put my cane in the overhead, stating I couldn’t have it with me. This meant no heading down the aisle to the restroom. Granted it wasn’t that far but I don’t think others would want me using their seats for support to walk. When I finally arrived at my final destination I watched as the luggage handlers used my chair to pile strollers, etc., to take them inside, tearing one armrest. When I called to let them know what happened they said I couldn’t prove it wasn’t this way before.
Shades of “United breaks guitars”.
TSA and the airlines are doing more to ruin the business of flying than the economy has.
Comment by Cutting Torch
January 21, 2010 @ 8:27 pm:
My sis also had a few things to say, which we made sure everyone heard. Such as welcome to the police state. “Never question authority sheep” and so on.
Problem here–and it’s my first instinct, too–is that an appeal to conscience doesn’t work with these types, however effective it may be with such decent people as you evidently are.
I first learned this in Cub Scouts, where everyone involved with the organization, adults as well as children, professed a devotion to the “OnmyhonorIwilldomybestotdomydutytoGodandmycountry,” stuff, but clearly practiced only a policy of “Might makes right” and of hatred and fear of anything that fell outside narrow parameters of the status quo. It hasn’t changed–it carries over into every official institution I’ve ever been involved with.
First off, you do act like a dick. Sorry but it had to be said. Second, your own behavior triggered a lot of the actions they took; I think they showed a lot of restraint. And, because of the way you were behaving, it was essentially wasting their time, because you were not a threat. Thanks for wasting tax payer dollars. I don’t think they thought you were a terrorist, they just thought you were crazy.
Do I believe the TSA is evil? No. I think it is a bloated government agency forced into existence by the real terrorists, and as with any agency it is populated by good and bad people. People have flaws. And, they are doing a better job than when the airlines themselves had responsibility for it.
I do think our rights are being taken away, but I worry more about my rights on the city street, not in what I would want to be a secure area, so my plane will actually make it to my destination.
I believe the TSA has tried to perform it’s duties in a respectful way in most cases, although some ‘people’ in the organization are idiots. But, in showing that restraint the terrorists are creative and will push the limits of what is acceptable, and as a result the TSA has to push its activities to ‘try’ and maintain a secure area. (The whole not getting up are doing anything for the final hour of a flight is just stupid)
I don’t like the idea of the body scanners, and the ability to capture images was misleading. Do I think they are the secret plot of Child pornographers, no! There you were really out of line and I don’t know if I would have been as restrained as the officers were. Note: I am the father of two, and I would have been tempted to bitch slap you for making that accusation.
By the simple fact that you were able to film everything, and walk away from the investigation a free man and take your flight, shows that your rights were intact and generally respected. If this were Russia of old or China, you would not be telling this story.
I respect your right to film this and make a point to be mindful of our rights and shake people up. But, of all the people you filmed and tried to make look bad, they were respectful of you, even though you were being a complete dick. They were doing their jobs, and while you were trying to make a point… you were just wasting their time and generally insulting them.
If you want to help protect our rights, take a little of the crazy out of your arguments and focus on some of the other things the government has passed. Warrantless wire taps, NSA taps at AT&T offices, Video and photography bans in New York City and other places, out in public!
Before seeing your video, I didn’t care about body scanners. After this, I am 100% against them.
Mitch
First off, you do act like a dick. Sorry but it had to be said.
If you want to help protect our rights, take a little of the crazy out of your arguments and focus on ALL of the things the government has passed. Including the violent monopoly that is the TSA.
Tone down the violence too, it makes you sound like a boot licking idiot:
“I would have been tempted to bitch slap you for making that accusation.”
Comment by Mitch
January 22, 2010 @ 10:25 am:
I don’t know if I would have been as restrained . . . I would have been tempted to bitch slap you . . .
________________________
Here you give yourself away as being one with the TSA goons. Like them, your main motivation is obviously to visit violence against someone–anyone. You’ll trump up some sort of reason, just as they do, but you really just want to compensate for some inward inadequacy, probably known only to yourself, that physically demeaning others helps to quell. If you’d work on those inner strengths, such brute tactics would be unnecessary.
Sam, you weren’t acting like a Dick, you were acting like a human, the TSA was acting worse. Besides, just because there is a sign posted saying that you are subject to random warrantless, unprobable caused search and seazure don’t make it right. What if they were to post a sign saying “Attention all minorities, you will be subject to becomeing a slave once you pass this search area.” , would that make it OK and right, just because a sign is posted? “Sorry sir, but we need you to put on these shakles and go out with the road gang and pick cotton, because it is important to your safety, and besides, we posted a sign!”
More power to you Sam, when I get to NH, I’ll help ya all I can!
I’ll give it to you, its a hard thing to skirt so close to the edge and not trip up to get arrested.
The lady said the security procedures were online, which makes it seem like their easy to get, but if you ask them what they are, they get suspicious. Whats that about?
I also dont like…at all… the imaging tech. I like taking the train and will do so from now on. I will never fly while that technology is required.
Rock On, Sam
Mitch,
Why was Sam being a dick when all he did was film? The ones that approached him for operating his camera in a lawful manner were the ones wasting taxpayer dollars.
If a police officer harasses someone for doing something completely legal, say, walking down a sidewalk, is it the person that was walking that is at fault?
Mitch -
I think you misunderstand why this interaction happened, and what started it. Sam was filming, and the TSA approached him (despite the manual instructions to not approach people filming or taking pictures) and asked him if he was “press”. His reply of ‘i’m not answering questions’ may seem like a “dick move” to you, but consider this:
A few years ago I worked on the show ‘Trading Spouses’. One of my jobs was to take a rental van, make it look like a taxi cab, and pick up the “new mom” from the airport with the camera crew set up in the van and another following the characters in the airport (outside the ‘secure area’ of course). While waiting for everyone to load up in the van so we could go, a TSA agent came up to the driver side window, and asked me what taxi service i was with. Not thinking anything of it, i replied, “oh, i’m not with a taxi service, we are filming a TV show and this is just a prop taxi cab.”
doesn’t seem like a big deal right? and i answered the question in a friendly tone, with no intent of hiding anything, cause why would i need to? well, it nearly cost me my job, because we were given a $950 ticket for using an ‘unregisterd airport taxi service’… apparently you have to register (aka pay dues) with the airport if you are a taxi who picks up people at the terminal.
so, knowing that the economy is down, government is growing and in need of more money, and they don’t see anything wrong with charging people HUGE fees for breaking “laws” that they didn’t know existed and are stupid to begin with… where is the reasoning that refusing to answer TSA agent’s questions makes one “a dick”? cause that is what started all this. and if the original cause of the interaction was a gross abuse of authority, where is the sense in treating those who abuse that ‘authority’ with any respect what so ever? they need to be told what they are doing is wrong; and moreover, they need to be treated with the amount of respect they have earned by implementing these abusive actions… to do otherwise would only give them more strength in their bloated egos and sense of authoritarianism.
also, to zholzapfel:
enjoy the train while you can. TSA has been taking over train stations as well. if they aren’t stopped soon, it’s only a matter of time till train stations, ship yards, highway checkpoints, boarder crossings, and even special events (like presidential appearances) are all just as bad as the airports.
and as if the body scanners weren’t bad enough… i have seen studies about the possible use of a tazer bracelet that every airline passenger would be required to wear in the airport and on the flight. would those who support the TSA be cool with that too? after all, it’s not like they would fuck up and taze an old lady with a heart problem… or a kid making too much noise… or someone with a stomach ache taking a little too long in the bathroom… would they?
“America does not have an airline security system designed to stop terrorists. It has an airline security system designed to bother people.”
Yeffet Isaac, former head of security for Israeli El Al Airlines.
Here’s a good example of the type of folks who “work” for Homeland Stupidity:
(Sorry, you have to sit through one of those irritating 20 sec. commercials, but the vid is worth it!)
So nice to see that ThinkLiberty hasn’t given up on his brilliant “I-know-you-are-but-what-am-I” form of argumentation. It’s like the smile on the face of a drunken alcoholic; most people can see that he’s an idiot, but at least he’s come up with a mechanism for dulling his pain. Congrats.
First off, you do act like a dick. Sorry but it had to be said.
Yeah, no kidding. All the TSA did was try to film Sam, in public, where he has no expectation of privacy. Then Sam started following the TSA agents, came over with a gun, forced the TSA agents to show ID, on threat of violence, and asked them a bunch of personal questions, which were none of his business. Sam then dumped their luggage out, and searched through it, with no warrant or permission. I agree — totally unacceptable.
Oh wait, I got that completely backwards. Looks like the TSA were dicks, and it looks like you’re a run of the mill boot licker.
Second, your own behavior triggered a lot of the actions they took;
How does that make it ok? If you piss me off, and I slug you, does that make my assault justified because you “triggered” my action? The TSA agents are morally responsible for everything they did, and you’re morally responsible for supporting it.
I think they showed a lot of restraint.
I think it had a lot to do with the camera. I have no doubt that without it Sam would have been arrested, and maybe beat up too.
It’s kind of interesting how these people hate getting filmed, don’t you think? — They film us a ll the time. Cockroaches fear the light, and scumbags fear accountability.
And, because of the way you were behaving, it was essentially wasting their time, because you were not a threat.
Sam didn’t force them to harass them, they did that. He wanted to be left alone, and asked to be left alone repeatedly. Again, they’re responsible for their own actions. They wasted their time, and his, and violated his rights.
Thanks for wasting tax payer dollars.
Wow, that’s some serious Freudian projection. Does Sam get paid with tax money? No. Was it his idea for them to harass him? No, he just wanted to be left alone.
Talk about blaming the victim.
I don’t think they thought you were a terrorist, they just thought you were crazy.
Ah, so they like following and harassing crazy people, violating their privacy and personal property rights, and threatening them. Figures.
Of course, the truth is, they just can’t abide the thought of a person who doesn’t lick their shoes on command.
Do I believe the TSA is evil? No. I think it is a bloated government agency forced into existence by the real terrorists
Yes, because as we all know, bloated government agencies are the best way to deal with societal problems. Why, just look at the great job the DMV does, or the great job FEMA did after Katrina. Examine the terrific education students receive at public schools, the outstanding job the Federal Reserve does at managing the economy, and the financial soundness of Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. Check out how medical prices have fallen and quality has improved since government got heavily involved in medicine, in the mid 60s. I mean, it’s far better than the free market of the computer industry, where quality doesn’t improve, and prices go up.
Oh, wait, I got that completely backwards again.
By the way, if the FAA hadn’t had a rule against pilots and others having guns on planes, and a policy that said you had to submit to hijackers, 9/11 would never have happened.
How about this: Let each airline set their own security measures, and let people choose what airline they use. Some pay prefer lots of security measures, some may not. It’s called free choice, and it’s a heck of a lot better than coercive monopolies.
, and as with any agency it is populated by good and bad people.
The “good people” should get a job where they don’t violate peoples rights.
People have flaws. And, they are doing a better job than when the airlines themselves had responsibility for it.
Actually, I’d much prefer the airline industry operate more like it did before 9/11. The improvement in security has mainly come by people just being aware of what’s going on — hijackers get jumped by passengers. Letting the pilots have guns, and locking the cockpit would solve most of the rest of the problem.
We are descended from people who said, “Give me liberty or give me death”. Now we say, “Sure, take my privacy rights, and take my dignity too — also, go ahead and take naked pictures of me and my kids, just pweese, make me feel a wittle bit safer”.
I do think our rights are being taken away, but I worry more about my rights on the city street, not in what I would want to be a secure area
You have the same rights in a plane terminal as you would on the street. If you want to pay for an airline to fly you somewhere, that’s between you and the airline. The TSA doesn’t own you, the airline, your stuff, or the airport.
Don’t worry though, I don’t doubt that once they take all your rights away on the street too, they’ll be sure to call it a “secure area”, so you’ll be fine with it.
, so my plane will actually make it to my destination.
Lol at the belief that the TSA is effective.
Also, don’t be so afraid. There are thousands and thousands of flights every day, and maybe one wannabe terrorist attack per year, if that, most of which fail. You’re more likely to get run over walking to the store.
I believe the TSA has tried to perform it’s duties in a respectful way in most cases, although some ‘people’ in the organization are idiots. But,
If wishes and buts were candy and nuts … we’d still have a constitutional republic.
in showing that restraint the terrorists are creative and will push the limits of what is acceptable, and as a result the TSA has to push its activities to ‘try’ and maintain a secure area.
Right, so because one nutso tries and fails to blow up his crotch, they must examine the crotches of each of the millions of passangers that fly every year. That makes sense. Wait, no it doesn’t.
I can’t wait for the guy who swallows a balloon with explosives or something, so we can all get our stomachs pumped before boarding planes.
The method of: “Bad guy tried to attack us by doing x, therefore we must forcibly prevent anyone from having the capability to do that ever again” is a recipe for total tyranny.
Let’s apply that to general life: Bad guy used a gun in a robbery. So, we must outlaw all guns. Bad guy used a knife in a robbery, so, we must outlaw all knives. Bad guy used a rope to choke victim, therefore, we must outlaw all rope. Bad guy used fists to commit assault, therefore we must all wear handcuffs. Bad guy drinks too much and gets into a fight, so we must outlaw all alcohol. Bad guy runs someone over intentionally, so we must outlaw all cars.
Being free IMPLIES that there will always be some risk. A person who pledges to eliminate all risk is a person who wants to be a tyrant.
(The whole not getting up are doing anything for the final hour of a flight is just stupid)
No kidding. I think if the bomber had been singing “mary had a little lamb”, they’d have outlawed that too.
I don’t like the idea of the body scanners, and the ability to capture images was misleading. Do I think they are the secret plot of Child pornographers, no!
Perhaps not, but will those who want too look at naked people, or naked kids, try and succeed at getting their hands on them, or being the ones in the booths? Quite possibly.
The point is, we don’t know — and free people should not be forced to hope that the government will not abuse them.
We should not be totally reliant on and subservient to the government. Always think: If the government became truly abusive, what could they do with the power they have?
Because governments, historically, always have.
Give up all your rights to the government, and hope they’ll treat you well, is not the recipe for a free society. It is the recipe for fascism, and genocide.
There you were really out of line and I don’t know if I would have been as restrained as the officers were. Note: I am the father of two, and I would have been tempted to bitch slap you for making that accusation.
Violence. Nice.
So I get it, he’s supposed to just trust these guys, because ….. ?
Would you let someone take naked pictures of your kids, just because they double pinky promised that they weren’t scumballs?
By the simple fact that you were able to film everything, and walk away from the investigation a free man and take your flight, shows that your rights were intact and generally respected.
Oh, I see, so so much for the fourth amendment. Why, government officials can go through your stuff at any time, just for the heck of it, take naked pictures of you, perhaps rough you up a bit, demand personal information, threaten you, and it’s all ok, as long as you can walk away.
Apparently that’s our only right left now: after you get abused, you can probably sometimes walk away.
Oh, and newsflash: probably the only reason he did walk away was because of the camera.
If this were Russia of old or China, you would not be telling this story.
So, because there have existed regimes, in the past, which were even more tyrannical, this one’s ok.
Basically, Vinny from Cleveland, who breaks fingers for a living, is ok, because he’s not Al Capone.
I respect your right to film this and make a point to be mindful of our rights and shake people up. But, of all the people you filmed and tried to make look bad, they were respectful of you, even though you were being a complete dick.
They weren’t respectful. They dumped his stuff, harassed him, threatened him, followed him, and demanded personal information on threat of violence.
Sam just filmed them.
Your double standard is mind-boggling.
If sam had done to them what they did to him, he’d be in jail for a long time.
They were doing their jobs
So? The fact that they get paid (with his stolen money) to abuse him makes it all ok?
Immoral jobs should not be done.
, and while you were trying to make a point… you were just wasting their time and generally insulting them.
The interaction was initiated and maintained by them. Sam just wanted to be left alone. He didn’t waste their time, they wasted his.
If you want to help protect our rights, take a little of the crazy out of your arguments and focus on some of the other things the government has passed. Warrantless wire taps, NSA taps at AT&T offices, Video and photography bans in New York City and other places, out in public!
The airport is public too.
I posted a comment, which apparently got dumped. Could it be restored? Thanks!
Edit: Ok, it’s up now — thanks again.
So unpleasant to see that ANAMAZEDREADER hasn’t given up on his retarded “You are a poo poo face” form of argumentation. It’s like the old bigoted man that calls everyone names for no reason; most people can see that he’s a hate filled idiot, but at least he’s come up with a mechanism for dulling his pain. Congrats.
I like speaking to people in a way that they can comprehend. If I use a lot of the same words that they use, I feel like it will help them understand me better. 
Seems to me that Sam is the juvenile weirdo. What a self-centered, self-important jerk!
@THINKLIBERTY wrote
“So unpleasant to see that ANAMAZEDREADER hasn’t given up on his retarded “You are a poo poo face” form of argumentation. It’s like the old bigoted man that calls everyone names for no reason; most people can see that he’s a hate filled idiot, but at least he’s come up with a mechanism for dulling his pain. Congrats.”
Q.E.D.
Yes, cinco, how dare he claim to own himself or his property. Doesn’t he know that the government owns everything, and has a right to do whatever it pleases? If they want to force him to give them his personal information, to go through his personal effects without a warrant, to stop his filming in public, and want to force him to pay for the privilege, there’s nothing for him but to say, “Yes masters. Thank you masters. Would you like naked pictures of me too, masters?
Why, what does that serf think he is, a free man?!
We should all remember the immortal words of Patrick Henry: “Take my liberty, and my dignity too — just please make me feel a little safer”. That is how it went, right?
Enough bickering. How about some action? Webmail some complaint to TSA: https://contact.tsa.dhs.gov/DynaForm.aspx?FormID=10
Let them know–politely–that some of their agents could use some basic training to avoid turning a molehill into a mountain.
Love,
Great Video.
A little advise. Carry the Constitution and Bill of Rights with you.
God Bless America!
Sam, I thought the loaded questions to the officers about “child pornography” was out of line. It didn’t help your cause; if anything, it just pissed off any that were potentially sympathetic to our cause.
That said, good job. Some of these officers wouldn’t know a constitutionally protected right if it bit them on the ass. I don’t think a lot of them realize (a) what rights are actually guaranteed in the Bill of Rights and (b) that these trump any and all contradictory federal laws, regulations, departmental policy, and any training they undoubtedly have received. I would be willing to bet that the officer asking you “What is the Bill of Rights?” would be hard pressed to answer that question *correctly* himself.
Officer Friendly with the K-9 was a real piece of work. It’s amazing what sorts of people gravitate towards jobs like this containing lots of opportunity for bullying the general public. I would have found it really hard not to get arrested in that situation.
Do you think you’re on a no-fly list now?
> Sam, I thought the loaded questions to the officers about “child pornography” was out of line. It didn’t help your cause; if anything, it just pissed off any that were potentially sympathetic to our cause.
If the officers weren’t harassing him the comment wouldn’t have been made. I know when I get harassed by these goons I tend to get a little upset too.
Freedom of speech is just that – freedom of speech. If you don’t want to hear what someone has to say, don’t engage them.
O.K. Sam, Heres the truth. First of all, as your fellow bloggers can see, if you look at the numbers in the upper right hand corner of each blog, you will see that if SAM does not like what you have to say, he just removes your comment. If SAM doesnt like it, your comment gets removed. Wait a minute, what about “Freedom of speech”??? Im sure this post will be removed also. Anyway, just wanted to expose SAM’S scam. Now, lets get to the real issue….Sam talks about child porn and pediphiles, which brings us back to the real issue of why SAM does what he does. Sam has a real problem with Law Enforcement, and I will tell you why. I think Sam was a victim of some sort of assault when he was a young boy. Most likely a sexual assault. Thats why he has the fear of child molesters & pediphiles. The police never came to help him during these assaults. Because SAM never had the guts to call and report it. Now, years later, SAM hates the police. So he gets his camera and tries to make the police look bad. Its very sad SAM but the police are not your enemies. If you would have reported the incidents when they were happening, you wouldent be acting like a silly “CODE 30″. I suggest you take your cameras and go to Washington to focus on the real GOONS and criminals…the current admin. These are the people to be afraid of SAM, not the police. And the next time you visit the Airport, try to be a good boy SAM. You WILL end up in jail. Your lucky that you were not arrested the last time. You just happend to have police, that are trained to handle people with mental illness, show up at your circus video production. Next time you may not be so lucky. Good luck SAM, i hope you get the help you need and im sorry about your past. So sad…So very sad.
Hey, I wonder what happened to post numbers 86075 and 86076 ?
Responding to Chumlee:
Sam has every right to delete whatever he wants from his own property. He’s in no way obligated to let *anyone* say what they want on *his* property. He has absolutely no moral reason to let anyone that opposes his views on liberty trash him on his own property.
That said, how is he scamming you when *you* came here to voice *your* opinion?
Why should he be afraid of being jailed in an airport when the state is pretty much allowed to jail you anywhere and anytime with no reason right now?
You are right, he should be afraid of being imprisoned. Problem is, we’re already being imprisoned, ever so slowly. You should be afraid too, and willing to step out of the kool-aid line.
Anonymous…First of all I can see that you also are a COWARD posting as “anonymous”. Secondly, he complains and cries about FREE SPEeCH, yet you say he can remove any comment that he does not agree with? Played right into my hand. And speaking of a “KOOL-AID” line? The only kool-aid line there was is the one you and sam were in on November 4th 2008. When you took a gig giant gulp, and cast your vote for the government that is controlling the very people that your in fear of. Your pathetic ANONYMOUS. You will follow the rules and you will like it. PERIOD.
Chumlee, the numbering system is for the whole site. When there is a break in the numbers, it only means someone posted on another story.
I’ve never been sexually assaulted in my life. I, and many many others, can’t stand what the cops are becoming, or the TSA. They are not peace officers anymore — connected to the community, motivated to maintain peace, and stop those who have harmed innocents. They have become authoritarian goons, enforcing their will and the politicians’ with violence on a hair trigger. The stories of abuse pile up by the day, and the “thin blue line” always defends even the most outrageous behavior of its own. Good cops would stand up against the abuse, not defend it. They would also stand against the blatant violations of the constitution, and of basic human decency, that occur continually.
Few good cops still exist.
> Anonymous…First of all I can see that you also are a COWARD posting as “anonymous”.
You’re just as anonymous. Why does my handle have any impact on my personal fortitude in comparison to anyone else on this site?
> Secondly, he complains and cries about FREE SPEeCH, yet you say he can remove any comment that he does not agree with? Played right into my hand.
The two aren’t contradictory, I suggest you learn something about a concept called ‘private property.’
> And speaking of a “KOOL-AID” line? The only kool-aid line there was is the one you and sam were in on November 4th 2008. When you took a gig giant gulp, and cast your vote for the government that is controlling the very people that your in fear of. Your pathetic ANONYMOUS. You will follow the rules and you will like it. PERIOD.
lol
Well hello paul. I was hoping you would respond. Im not buying the “Responding to other topics” answer you gave in reference to the numbers missing on the blogs. Im pretty sure your removing posts. But,like “Anonymous” said…its your site. You can control the whole conversation. Too bad you couldent at Metro.
Ok Chumlee, click on the main page. Notice that your comment is now the second most recent under the “Most recent comments” list, on the right. Notice that the number next to your comment is “86086″. Now click on the comment right below yours. It’s on the brad jardis thread. Here’s a link: http://freekeene.com/2010/01/24/the-heroic-brad-jardis-kicked-out-of-leap/comment-page-1/#comment-86085
And the number on the comment? 86085, one before yours.
Can we drop the paranoia now?
And I’m not an admin by the way, so I’m not controlling anything. I know the way the software works is that if you have lots of links, the post gets automatically placed into the spam folder. It’s happened to me once before — just ask, and an admin will repost it.
If somehow a comment of yours got lost (are you sure you answered the math question correctly?) just repost.
Boy,you go away a few days,and look what happens!! I have been having fun with the TSA,but no camera.Remember,it is not a matter of security,it is a plan to get us all used to being asked for our ‘papers’,and being searched,at any time. —bil
Whadamm, Sam! Loved every minute. To think, you didn’t even speak of the DNA damage or cancer concerns of the full body scanners. TSA= Totally Stupid Asshats.
Keep ‘em coming.
Paul, please stop feeding the trolls. The scrap fish tossed over the side of a fishing boat to attract other, more-desired fish, is known as *CHUM*…as in, chumlee…///…& now thinkliberty and anamazedreader are spatting!!!…this is the most fun I’ve had on a Friday night in a long time…If enough folks stop flying commercial airlines, we can put the whole TSA out of business…dreaming, dreaming…….
This incident has been covered by the local news in Detroit:
http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/22368244/detail.html
Comments seem to be leading in the “This guy’s a jerk” direction. It is sad that so many are ready to throw away all their freedom for a false sense of security.
They call him a “vigilante journalist”. Vigilante means “any person who takes the law into his or her own hands”. I don’t think that’s a very accurate representation of what Sam was doing, but it does sound pretty cool!
I am glad I live in NH, away from the boot licking idiots that plague Detroit.
I agree w/ your rights to film. However, and there is a BIG however here, you pushed this situation to extremes. Once you pass through the secure area in the airports, you consent to searches just by entering into the area. Those are the rules posted very clearly as you enter into the premises (much like a concert venue). The TSA agent should not have confronted you, but she did. Other actions should have been taken to ensure a better outcome, not being so confrontational would have been a good step. You provoked them, and clearly said you were going to “have some fun” with the TSA agents and that is when your mass problems started. Had you left well enough alone everything would have gone smoothly. You “having fun” (as seen in video 2) provoked the situation to what it became.
I fought for your liberties protected under the constitution for 6 years, and that was violently taken away from me (I would have given the full 20 years) from an injury caused by war. So lets not twist this into I don’t believe in your rights. I do. As much as I despise the idea, everyone has the right to burn our flag without repercussions. You have the right to film, within the laws provided to us. You just pushed the situation a little too far with you wanting to “have some fun with the TSA agents.”
LOL@FREEDOMFIGHTER You think you fought for people’s liberty and protected the constitution by volunteering for a job in a standing army that has been engaging in illegal wars for the last 50 years? If you join the military and get hurt that’s called karma.
What illegal war did you get hurt in? Let me guess, you had everyone else to pay for your injury? Even those people that are opposed to the illegal war you wanted to fight in.
Sam is a really freedom fighter. The TSA is a violent monopoly that only exists because they can steal people’s money via taxation. They don’t keep anyone safe, they just leach money from productive people. If the TSA was any good at providing security, they would not need a government monopoly to provide it.
Violent thugs are easy to provoke. Sam did a good job exposing them for what they are. The TSA acted like any other criminal gang would act.
Everyone should videotape the TSA at the airport, exactly like Sam did. It’s as close to perfect that anyone will ever get. (Please prove me wrong, by doing it. 
)
Once you pass through the secure area in the airports, you consent to searches just by entering into the area.
Uh, no. This is a big fat fail. They no more own the airports than they own the passengers, the bags, or the airplane. They have no right to force people to submit to warrant-less searches just because they’re in the area. Why not just get it over with, and declare that once I step out of my front door I “consent” to have my rights violated?
My rights apply everywhere. Period.
Those are the rules posted very clearly as you enter into the premises (much like a concert venue).
See, thing is, the rules at a concert are posted by the OWNERS. Last I checked, the government doesn’t own the country. Or are they admitting we’re full on serfs now? The progress of tyranny is so hard to keep up with.
you provoked them, and clearly said you were going to “have some fun” with the TSA agents and that is when your mass problems started.
No, the problems started when he was approached, harassed, and followed by the TSA, for peaceably filming a large distance away, as is his right. The TSA instigated the conflict every step of the way. Sam just wanted to be left alone.
Not obeying the every order of bureaucrats in funny outfits does not constitute “instigating conflict” by the way. Giving immoral and unconstitutional orders does.
I fought for your liberties protected under the constitution for 6 years, and that was violently taken away from me (I would have given the full 20 years) from an injury caused by war. So lets not twist this into I don’t believe in your rights.
No war in the last 60 years has had anything to do with our liberties. There are plenty of soldier-tyrants. I’m not saying you’re one — you sound like you have a more balanced perspective than some TSA apologists, but the fact that you were in the military is certainly no evidence that you respect liberty.
I dunno how you do your neat little green letter trick so I just will star your points.
***** Uh, no. This is a big fat fail. They no more own the airports than they own the passengers, the bags, or the airplane. They have no right to force people to submit to warrant-less searches just because they’re in the area. Why not just get it over with, and declare that once I step out of my front door I “consent” to have my rights violated?
My rights apply everywhere. Period. ******
This is incorrect. Your rights do not apply everywhere. You consent to searches in airports under the rules posted. Under the law provided to you by the consistitution of the United States of America (The United States Supreme court has upheld this particular law), once it is posted in a clearly visable area that you consent to search (IE: Airports, Military Bases, the White House, or any other venue) and you enter under your own free will, you consent to search. Period.
***** See, thing is, the rules at a concert are posted by the OWNERS. Last I checked, the government doesn’t own the country. Or are they admitting we’re full on serfs now? The progress of tyranny is so hard to keep up with. ******
Unfortunately, the government does own this country, in technical terms. They make the laws that we obide by or we suffer the consequences.
******No, the problems started when he was approached, harassed, and followed by the TSA, for peaceably filming a large distance away, as is his right. The TSA instigated the conflict every step of the way. Sam just wanted to be left alone. ******
Sam CLEARLY says I am going to have some fun with these guys, provoking the TSA agents into the confrontation. Please see minute 3:18 of film #1. He provkes them. They were only following him. Big deal. Once he interacted with them (ON HIS TERMS!) his problems started. I can’t find his “lets have some fun line in the film again, but it is said (I am not searching 21:00 or so of film though for it. Not only did he do that. He provoked one by calling him a terrorist in minute 3:35 of film #1. That is absurd. While the TSA is clearly idiotic at times (IE making someone drink their own breast milk, or something along those lines), they do not hire terrorist.
***** Not obeying the every order of bureaucrats in funny outfits does not constitute “instigating conflict” by the way. Giving immoral and unconstitutional orders does. ******
If you don’t like our laws that are provided to you, you are free to move to a country that has more liberal laws that you like (such as Iraq…. wait they cut your fingers off if you rob someone. Or France… wait they don’t have the miranda rights. Or Mexico… uh no… they have impoverished prisons. Canada? Maybe you’ll like it there. Oh nope. They operate under French law (see France). Maybe Brittian? Nope again. They can search your home w/o a search warrant. I guess you’re stuck unless you can think of a country with better and more liberal rights).
****** No war in the last 60 years has had anything to do with our liberties. There are plenty of soldier-tyrants. I’m not saying you’re one — you sound like you have a more balanced perspective than some TSA apologists, but the fact that you were in the military is certainly no evidence that you respect liberty. ******
Unfortunately you are right about solder tyrants. But there are also people who think blacks should be slaves and not have the right to vote (the KKK in particular). There are people who believe women should be in the kitchen fat and pregnant, not in the work force. There are people who believe that gay’s should’t have the same rights as everyone else. There are also people who believe immigration should be cut off to everyone. There are people who believe that the rich should pay for the poor. There are people who believe that welfare should be a government gift for life. There are people who believe something that isn’t right with our common morals at every turn we make. That does not make them right, that makes them idiots of the first class nature. I joined the service I joined because I believe in the Bill of Rights, the US Consistitution, the laws we are provided and every other thing that is uniquely American. I freely signed that piece of paper knowing one day I may die for those ideals, even in a war I didn’t argee with (which I don’t). But I damn near did die and give the ultimate sacrafice along with 2500+ other of my friends. I respect your liberties more than the common man that you will meet. I don’t agree with the Patriot Act. I don’t like that our communications can be tapped at any time without warrants. I don’t agree with many policies that have come out recently. But they are there. And because I can’t find another country in the world that gives us such freedoms, I will live with them. I trust in the person I voted for (Obama). I trust that he will make most everything right, as much as he can with the 4 years that the conservate US will give us liberals until they massively f up again with another GW. But in the mean time live with the laws given. One of them is you consent to search once you enter the secure area of the US airports. See the signs posted, and the supreme court rulings which up held those signs.
We can keep editing our comments back and forth to fit our arguements (which I know a few will do), or we can agree to disagree. I disagree with you for this reason: I believe the searches are for the good of the whole flight. One person, or two, or 50, or 75, or the entire damn flight being searched is fine with me so long as no damn bombs make it on board. I don’t want to end up in a large tower, in the side of the Pentagon (God Rest your souls brother and sisters (both from the plane and who gave for service to your country that day)), the a field in some state, in the bottom of the sea, or any place else in little bits and pieces. Here’s what should piss me off but doesn’t: I was leaving to go to Germany for my overseas tour (we are mostly routed through Germany on our way to Iraq or Afghanistan) in service uniform, and was searched while an Arabic gentleman freely passed through without a second glance. Did I fuss? Hell no. I should have, because I was in uniform and had orders to deploy to a war zone. But I knew there was a chance (albeit a small chance) that a terrorist could dress in BDU’s and fake some orders. So I took 5 minutes and inconvienced myself to let someone look in my bags after I passed through into the secure area as I was boarding the plane. The agent said thank you and thanked me for my service. Was I pleased? Hell to the NO. But it happened, and I went on with my day without provoking a confrontation. Sam could have left after the first encounter. He didn’t.
“This is incorrect. Your rights do not apply everywhere.”
Those rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights are natural and by definition apply always and everywhere. Though I can grant consent for a search, I can at any time revoke that consent no matter where I happen to be standing at the time.
I dunno how you do your neat little green letter trick so I just will star your points.
It’s the “blockquote” tag — look right above the window where you type messages, and there are a list of tags you can use.
This is incorrect. Your rights do not apply everywhere. You consent to searches in airports under the rules posted. Under the law provided to you by the consistitution of the United States of America (The United States Supreme court has upheld this particular law),
What the supreme court says does not determine morality. They’ve said slavery was a-ok too.
once it is posted in a clearly visable area that you consent to search (IE: Airports, Military Bases, the White House, or any other venue) and you enter under your own free will, you consent to search. Period.
Perhaps they should just post one of these signs outside my front door, then they can claim I “consent” to their abuse 24/7.
The fact that they put up a sign no more gives them the right to forcibly search people than the fact that I put up a sign would give me the right to do so. “Clearly visible” is not the issue. They have no right to force everyone who enters the airport to obey their arbitrary diktats.
Unfortunately, the government does own this country, in technical terms. They make the laws that we obide by or we suffer the consequences.
Nope, I don’t accept this. I am a free man, not a slave. The king of England didn’t own this country, and neither does Barney Frank. I own myself, I own my labor, and I own my land, which I acquired by the free exchange of that labor.
Street gangs like MS-13 also act like they own their “territory”, as do mobsters like Al-Capone. The reality is, all they have is the immoral threat of aggressive violence, to force obedience and to extort property from innocent people.
Legitimate ownership is created by free exchange of the fruit of one’s labor — not acquired by threats of violence.
Sam CLEARLY says I am going to have some fun with these guys, provoking the TSA agents into the confrontation. Please see minute 3:18 of film #1. He provkes them. They were only following him. Big deal. Once he interacted with them (ON HIS TERMS!) his problems started. I can’t find his “lets have some fun line in the film again, but it is said (I am not searching 21:00 or so of film though for it. Not only did he do that. He provoked one by calling him a terrorist in minute 3:35 of film #1. That is absurd. While the TSA is clearly idiotic at times (IE making someone drink their own breast milk, or something along those lines), they do not hire terrorist.
Actually, he was harassed by the TSA starting at 1:22, when all he had done was film them. He stated that he didn’t want to interact, and they said “you WILL come with us”.
You missed the point of the terrorist comment. He was pointing out the double standard. All the TSA needs to do is be “suspicious” of him, and they can demand ID, and go through his luggage. But, if Sam is suspicious of one of them, he can do nothing of the kind.
Also, I would say forcing someone to drink their own breast milk goes a long way past “idiotic”. What would happen to me if I did such a thing? I’d be in jail for many years.
If you don’t like our laws that are provided to you, you are free to move
Sorry, neither you nor the government owns the country, nor do you have a right to force me out of it if I don’t obey your arbitrary diktats, or hand you half of my money every year.
to a country that has more liberal laws that you like (such as Iraq…. wait they cut your fingers off if you rob someone. Or France… wait they don’t have the miranda rights. Or Mexico… uh no… they have impoverished prisons. Canada? Maybe you’ll like it there. Oh nope. They operate under French law (see France). Maybe Brittian? Nope again. They can search your home w/o a search warrant. I guess you’re stuck unless you can think of a country with better and more liberal rights).
Oh, governments around the world are mostly as abusive as the U.S. government, or more so. I’m not going to argue with you there. That doesn’t make abuse ok.
Suppose every country on the planet still had brutal slavery of people of African descent, but slaves were allowed to choose what plantation they went to. Suppose someone objected to being enslaved. Would you tell them, “Well, go somewhere where the slavery is better, if you don’t like it.”? Of course not. You’d recognize that they have a right to their liberty, and the fact that other places have slavery too does not make slavery moral.
The same applies here. Theft is theft, and abuse is abuse. The fact that other governments would extort my property from me as well does not make the practice acceptable.
Unfortunately you are right about solder tyrants. But there are also people who think blacks should be slaves and not have the right to vote (the KKK in particular). There are people who believe women should be in the kitchen fat and pregnant, not in the work force. There are people who believe that gay’s should’t have the same rights as everyone else. There are also people who believe immigration should be cut off to everyone. There are people who believe that the rich should pay for the poor. There are people who believe that welfare should be a government gift for life. There are people who believe something that isn’t right with our common morals at every turn we make. That does not make them right, that makes them idiots of the first class nature.
There certainly are lots of people with immoral beliefs. Did you intend for your statement here to make a point beyond this?
I joined the service I joined because I believe in the Bill of Rights, the US Consistitution, the laws we are provided and every other thing that is uniquely American.
Many laws often have been, and are immoral. Even the constitution itself has, and does, endorse immoral behavior. The beginning of this country, taken as a whole, was a huge leap forward for liberty over anything that had existed before, but it was not the be all end all. We need to keep moving forward, until we no longer accept or tolerate aggressive violence, and violations of liberty, no matter who perpetrates it.
Jefferson said that every generation needs a revolution — I agree, but add that it can and should be a peaceful one. We are mainly regressing, as a country, and we have been for at least 200 years.
Liberty is the principle for which the colonies won their independence, and it is to liberty that we should be beholden — not to any government.
I freely signed that piece of paper knowing one day I may die for those ideals, even in a war I didn’t argee with (which I don’t).
I don’t want to offend you, but in the interests of bold and honest discussion, why do you believe dying in a war with which you don’t agree would further those ideals? If the war is unwise, or worse, immoral, why would furthering that war further anything but foolishness and immorality? Would it not be better to stand against it publicly, as one should stand against all foolish and immoral things?
I respect your liberties more than the common man that you will meet. I don’t agree with the Patriot Act. I don’t like that our communications can be tapped at any time without warrants. I don’t agree with many policies that have come out recently. But they are there. And because I can’t find another country in the world that gives us such freedoms, I will live with them.
I am glad you disagree with these things, but instead of tolerating them, why not fight against them — the way Harriet Tubman, Rosa Parks, MLK, Susan Anthony, Gandhi, and others fought against the immorality of their day?
I trust in the person I voted for (Obama). I trust that he will make most everything right, as much as he can with the 4 years that the conservate US will give us liberals until they massively f up again with another GW.
Why do you trust Obama? As best I can tell he’s the third term of GW. We still have secret prisons, multiple wars going on overseas, wiretaps, the patriot act, signing statements, protection for the perpetrators of torture, etc.
You know what the biggest difference is now that Obama’s been elected? I no longer see anti-war protests on the side of the road, because the anti-war protesters were more interested in getting a president with a “D” next to his name, than actually ending war.
It was the same when the Republicans elected Bush. They all spoke against the big government of the democrats, but once Bush got in and increased government at astronomical rates, there was dead silence. They didn’t really want small government, they wanted the “R”s to win.
That’s what we’ve been reduced to. It has nothing to do with principle, it has everything to do with Red team vs. Blue team. There’s not a dime’s worth of difference between them, but each side is too furious at the other to notice.
But in the mean time live with the laws given.
Why should we “live with” immoral laws? Those among our ancestors who we most honor, were those who least tolerated immoral laws.
We can keep editing our comments back and forth to fit our arguements (which I know a few will do), or we can agree to disagree. I disagree with you for this reason: I believe the searches are for the good of the whole flight. One person, or two, or 50, or 75, or the entire damn flight being searched is fine with me so long as no damn bombs make it on board. I don’t want to end up in a large tower, in the side of the Pentagon (God Rest your souls brother and sisters (both from the plane and who gave for service to your country that day)), the a field in some state, in the bottom of the sea, or any place else in little bits and pieces.
Those are not the only alternatives. Remember Ben Franklin? He said: “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
There should be free choice in the air industry, as there are in other aspects of life. Different airlines can offer different security, and you can balance your desire for privacy with your desire for safety. You can choose the airline that contracts with the TSA for security, and takes naked pictures of everyone and their kids, if that’s really what you want. I’ll just choose the one that allows the pilots (and passengers) to have guns, and locks the cockpit door.
Patrick Henry said, “give me liberty or give me death”. Now we say, “Here, take all of my liberty, and my dignity too. Just make me feel a little safer”.
Sam could have left after the first encounter. He didn’t.
Rosa Parks could have moved to the back of the bus. I’m not saying their actions were equivalent, but they were for the same purpose: standing up for individual rights, against abusive government behavior.
Paul,
Like I said before, I am going to disagree with you. I suppose you will do the same with me. Have a great day. Hopefully one day you will see the foolishness that Sam caused himself. In the meantime have fun standing up against what you believe is immoral. Hopefully you don’t land your foolish butt in jail because I can guarentee you that those places aren’t nice.
Paul,
I lied. One last thing. I could name AT LEAST 10 operations or actions in the last 30 years (1/2 your 60 years quote) that had to do with our liberties.
1. 1980 – Operation Eagle Claw
2. 1983 – Operation Urgent Fury
3. 1985 – Italy. On October 10, 1985, US Navy pilots intercepted an Egyptian airliner and forced it to land in Sicily. The airliner was carrying the hijackers of the Italian cruise ship Achille Lauro who had killed an American citizen during the hijacking.
4. 1986 – Libya. Action in the Gulf of Sidra (1986) On March 26, 1986, President Reagan reported on March 24 and 25, US forces, while engaged in freedom of navigation exercises around the Gulf of Sidra, had been attacked by Libyan missiles and the United States had responded with missiles.
5. 1986 – Bolivia. U.S. Army personnel and aircraft assisted Bolivia in anti-drug operations.
6. 1987 – Persian Gulf. USS Stark was struck on May 17 by two Exocet antiship missiles fired from an Iraqi F-1 Mirage during the Iran-Iraq War killing 37 US Navy sailors.
7. 1987 –October 19, Operation Nimble Archer
8. 1987-88 – Operation Prime Chance
9. 1988 – Panama. In mid-March and April 1988, during a period of instability in Panama and as the United States increased pressure on Panamanian head of state General Manuel Noriega to resign, the United States sent 1,000 troops to Panama, to “further safeguard the canal, US lives, property and interests in the area.” The forces supplemented 10,000 US military personnel already in the Panama Canal Zone.
10. 1989 – Colombia, Bolivia, and Peru. Andean Initiative in War on Drugs.
11. 1989 – Operation Classic Resolve, Philippines
12. 1989-90 – Operation Just Cause, Panama
13. 1990 – Liberia. On August 6, 1990, President Bush reported that a reinforced rifle company had been sent to provide additional security to the US Embassy in Monrovia, and that helicopter teams had evacuated U.S. citizens from Liberia.
14. 1981 – Libya. First Gulf of Sidra Incident On August 19, 1981, US planes based on the carrier USS Nimitz shot down two Libyan jets over the Gulf of Sidra after one of the Libyan jets had fired a heat-seeking missile. The United States periodically held freedom of navigation exercises in the Gulf of Sidra, claimed by Libya as territorial waters but considered international waters by the United States.
15. 1991 – Operation Desert Shield and Operation Desert Storm (Persian Gulf War).
16. 1992-95 – Somalia. “Operation Restore Hope”
17. 1993 – Macedonia. On July 9, 1993, President Clinton reported the deployment of 350 US soldiers to the Republic of Macedonia to participate in the UN Protection Force to help maintain stability in the area of former Yugoslavia.
18. 1993 – Macedonia. On July 9, 1993, President Clinton reported the deployment of 350 US soldiers to the Republic of Macedonia to participate in the UN Protection Force to help maintain stability in the area of former Yugoslavia
19. 1996 – Operation Assured Response, Liberia.
20. 1996 – Operation Quick Response, Central African Republic.
21. 1997 – Operation Silver Wake, Albania
22. 1997 – Congo and Gabon. On March 27, 1997, President Clinton reported on March 25, 1997, a standby evacuation force of U.S. military personnel had been deployed to Congo and Gabon to provide enhanced security and to be available for any necessary evacuation operation
23. 1997 – Sierra Leone. On May 29 and May 30, 1997, U.S. military personnel were deployed to Freetown, Sierra Leone, to prepare for and undertake the evacuation of certain U.S. government employees and private U.S. citizens
24. 1997 – Cambodia. On July 11, 1997, In an effort to ensure the security of American citizens in Cambodia during a period of domestic conflict there, a Task Force of about 550 U.S. military personnel were deployed at Utapao Air Base in Thailand for possible evacuations
25. 1998 – Operation Infinite Reach, Afghanistan and Sudan.
26. 1999 – Operation Allied Force (also Operation Nobal Anvil)
27. 2000 – Sierra Leone. On May 12, 2000 a US Navy patrol craft deployed to Sierra Leone to support evacuation operations from that country if needed
28. 2000 – Yemen. On October 12, 2000, after the USS Cole attack in the port of Aden, Yemen, military personnel were deployed to Aden.
29. 2002 – Yemen. On November 3, 2002, an American MQ-1 Predator fired a Hellfire missile at a car in Yemen killing Qaed Senyan al-Harthi, an al-Qaeda leader thought to be responsible for the USS Cole bombing
30. 2002 – Philippines. OEF-Philippines
31. 2002 – Côte d’Ivoire. On September 25, 2002, in response to a rebellion in Côte d’Ivoire, US military personnel went into Côte d’Ivoire to assist in the evacuation of American citizens from Bouake.
32. 2003 – Liberia. Second Liberian Civil War On June 9, 2003, President Bush reported that on June 8 he had sent about 35 combat-equipped US military personnel into Monrovia, Liberia, to help secure the US Embassy in Nouakchott, Mauritania, and to aid in any necessary evacuation from either Liberia or Mauritania
33. 2006 – Pakistan. 17 people including known Al Qaeda bomb maker and chemical weapons expert Midhat Mursi, were killed in an American MQ-1 Predator airstrike on Damadola (Pakistan), near the Afghan border. (sucks to be them…)
34. 2006 – Lebanon. US Marine Detachment, the 24th Marine Expeditionary Unit[citation needed], begins evacuation of US citizens willing to the leave the country in the face of a likely ground invasion by Israel and continued fighting between Hezbollah and the Israeli military.
35. 2008 – South Ossetia, Georgia. Helped Georgia humanitarian aid[14], helped to transport Georgian forces from Iraq during the conflict. In the past, the US has provided training and weapons to Georgia
36. 2009 – Pakistan, In relation to efforts in Afghanistan, U.S. Forces struck an insurgent encampment in the Northern mountains, killing 24, with missiles fired from an unmanned aerial assault vehicle.
If we wanted to go back further in time I could easily get that number up to 60. I could easily name 60 operations or actions that were directly or indirectly linked to our freedom in the last 60 years. I named 36 in the last 30 years just now. The lesson here: Watch what you say with your comments, some of them are just plain recockulous.
Hi ‘freedomfighter’.
I just looked at your list of atrocities, and leaving aside the fact that I never heard of most of that stuff, in reading the list I find nothing in there that made me freer or defended my freedom in any way. Please explain to me how these actions defended me. You don’t have to do the whole list, just hit a couple high spots for me.
Thanks
One guy like Sam is a ‘vigilante’ or a ‘punk’ or a ‘crank’. 1000 people like Sam is a good start toward ending the harrassment of the people by unelected bureaucrats.
What Sam and those like him are doing is demonstrating to the people that they, too, can stand up against police state tyranny. Inevitably, more will gather the required courage, some inspired by those who have gone before, others reaching that point all on their own.
I applaud the bravery of all who stand up against these people and show them, or at least tell them, that they, too, are just people who eat and shit and sleep like the rest of us.
When this simple concept, the idea of true equality among men, sinks in to the hearts and minds of many, their cries of outrage will be heard often and loudly, and these things Sam is doing will be as a pebble compared to a rockslide.
That day cannot come soon enough.
Thank you, Sam, for bringing a tiny sliver of sanity to my neck of the woods.
Happy Trails!
I lied. One last thing. I could name AT LEAST 10 operations or actions in the last 30 years (1/2 your 60 years quote) that had to do with our liberties.
I said war, but ok, let’s take a look at these.
1980 – Operation Eagle Claw
This would never have happened if the CIA hadn’t overthrown the Shah. And I quote, “The Shah had been restored to power in a 1953 coup against a democratically elected nationalist Iranian government organized by the CIA at the American Embassy”
So, we overthrow their democratically elected leader, in an operation planned and executed from the embassy, and then they storm the embassy … hmmm.
If we minded our own business, we wouldn’t have so many problems.
1983 – Operation Urgent Fury
Are you kidding!?!? How on earth is invading Grenada a protection of our liberties?
1985 – Italy.
I’ll give you this one — rescuing people is good … although this is more of a police activity than a military one, and it’s certainly not a war.
Note how all of these take place outside of the United States. Whatever happened to the military protecting us from invasion? It’s called the “Department of Defense” after all … we don’t need 700 bases in 103 countries overseas, at a cost of hundreds of billions of dollars.
I support something a lot closer to the constitutional approach — militias.
1986 – Libya.
Again, how on earth does this defend any liberties? We shouldn’t have even been over there.
Bolivia. U.S. Army personnel and aircraft assisted Bolivia in anti-drug operations.
LMAO. The war on drugs DEFENDS liberty!??! Now I’ve heard everything. Nothing says “liberty” like the government telling me what I can and can’t put in my body.
Here’s a question:
Why do you think people go to the convenience store, rather than their local violent gang, to get beer?
Why do you think people don’t make aspirin in dangerous labs in their basements?
Why do you think cigarettes don’t fund terrorists overseas?
Why do you think people don’t break and enter to get money to buy coffee?
That’s right, because these things are legal. Prohibition didn’t work with alcohol, and it doesn’t work with drugs. It does, however, finance nearly every violent gang in the country, finance foreign terrorists, lead to property crime, destroy lives and families, and land over a million people in jail every year for simple possession, when they belong in a doctor’s office.
1987 – Persian Gulf.
We. Shouldn’t. Have. Been. Involved.
Post one about how the red army invaded Texas, and the military defended it. That would be a defense of our liberties.
1987 –October 19, Operation Nimble Archer
Great. We blew up an Iranian oil platform. I feel freer already. Oh wait, no I don’t.
Why do you think there are so many people who hate us in the middle east? Do you think it might have something to do with the fact that we’ve been overthrowing their leaders, subsidizing their enemies, conducting brutal economic sanctions, occupying their countries, and blowing up their family members for decades?
Naw, they probably just hate us for our freedom.
1987-88 – Operation Prime Chance
Shouldn’t have been involved with the conflict. Certainly had nothing to do with our liberties.
1988 – Panama.
Yes, because nothing says “defense of liberties” like overthrowing the head of state of Panama. I mean, overthrowing foreign heads of state is exactly what the founders envisioned as the role of the military.
Oh wait, I’m sorry, it’s pretty much exactly the opposite of what the founders envisioned.
1989 – Colombia, Bolivia, and Peru. Andean Initiative in War on Drugs.
See above, on the war on drugs. I’m sure this upped the price of drugs nicely, so the cartels could make a tidy profit, and addicts would have to rob even more people to get their fix.
You know how second amendment supporters say, “If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns?” I wonder why they never apply that logic to the drug trade …
1989 – Operation Classic Resolve, Philippines
I don’t support coups, but I also don’t support U.S. intervention — especially with tax money. And this certainly has nothing to do with defending our liberty.
12. 1989-90 Operation Just Cause, Panama
More foreign invasions and interference in the internal affairs of other nations. HooRay!
13. 1990 – Liberia.
I don’t think we should have embassies, but if we’re going to have them, rescuing those people when they’re in danger makes sense.
I’ll give you this one — but again, this is a rescue operation, not a war.
1981 – Libya.
Shouldn’t have been there. You think this is “defending liberty”!? Did you read these?
15. 1991 – Operation Desert Shield and Operation Desert Storm (Persian Gulf War).
We should not have been involved.
GTG for now, more later
LPVIPER,
Seems like your an uneducated woman or man. Paul seems to know what my list is and can speak on an inteligable level about them…
Paul,
I’ll wait until you’re done with my list to respond in an educated manner about them (like you are). I really can not stand the folks who call me an idiot or moron without explaining themselves fully (like you are).
Excuse me, but every one of the ventures you mentioned was carried out by a military that was funded by the involuntary taking of money from people in the United States. Every last one founded in and funded in theft and aggression.
Denigrate me as you will, but every time a gang steals from someone, I don’t like it and I will say something about it.
Thanks
LPVIPER,
You: womp womp woompawamp womp woopmpawamp
Me: ????
You: womp womp woompawamp womp woopmpawamp
Me: Please speak in a manner we all understand.
You: Blah blah blah blah blaaaahhhhhhh
Like I said, I will confine my conversation with folks that have something intelligable to say (like Paul). You already admitted you didn’t know diddly doodilly about what I listed.
You’re dismissed now LPVIPER.
Thank you for so politely excusing me from your glorification of paid killers paid with blood money. I needed a way out. I really appreciate it Mr. Bag, or shall I just call you Douche?
Cheers
LPVIPER,
I said you’re dismissed. Not please respond with more Womp Womp Wompawaaah Womp…
Let me spell it out for you
Y O U A R E D I S M I S S E D
That spells — You are dismissed
Bye now.
Dude is trolling. Quit feeding it.
Last war the US was in that was probably worth being in was WW2. Even though Socialism would’ve failed eventually anyways, it was still in our economic interest to help defend our trading partners.
Rest of the wars were just asserting our newfound military strength and world position on other (mostly unwilling) countries.
Paul,
I am not being sarcastic just inquistive here. Is that all that is going to be responded to in my list. If so I will respond. If not, I will wait until you’re done so I can respond to all of them at once.
Thanks
I will, sorry, I’ve just been busy. I’ll get to this as soon as I can.
Excuse me, asshat, but I’ll stay until Ian finally decides to kick me out.
Thanks anyway for your concern, I know you’re just looking out for me.
I can take care of myself.
Anyway, ‘freedomfighter’, you’re amusing me with all this Womp stuff. Honestly I thought my point was rather clear. What was not made clear was how you can reconcile all the ‘good deeds’ of the United States military with the bare assed FACT that their whole existence is based on theft from and aggression toward people IN THE UNITED STATES. How can an organization claim to be defending me when it plainly exists by aggressing against me? HMMM? Oh, I’m sorry, is this more Womp? Or do you cry Womp when you ain’t got a fuckin clue how to respond?
The suspense is killing me, not like killed by US military people killing, but anyway…
oh, jeezum crow, kids!!!….wicked stupid argument! LPVIPER, you stay, OK, YOU MY SPECIAL GUEST! Don’t let freedomspider, or whatever his(it’s???) name is – scare you off, OK?…*grin*…you’re correct, most of those were/are needless foreign interventions on our part – except – America “inherited” a couple thousand years of global intrigue. We’re just the biggest, baddest, country left standing, while China, & maybe Russia, etc.,rebuild for future “adventures”…///…I support the imminent military coup.
It was more fun than telling him to read his history. Notice the absence of rebuttal.
This is exactly why you can’t trust any government (and ours) that is in the business of infringing rights and grabbing guns.
Who do you think all these empty FEMA camps are for?
Hitler did the same thing; as did Stalin and the rest of those socialist dictators like Obama… build camps, grab guns, take away property rights; oh yeah property rights.
Think you own your car or house, take off the plates and stickers; they’ll lock you up under foreign commerce laws hiding the admiralty enforcement; stop paying property taxes you agreed to pay; and they’ll kick you out and sell your house and land; yeah, you’re free alright… feel screwed yet?
In the past 100 years; more than 70 million Citizens have been murdered by their own government right after they grabbed all the guns that people need to defend themselves, period.
If gun control works; then why do England’s cops now where body armor and traded in their sticks for guns in a gun free country?
Here\’s a solution to all the controversy over full-body scanners. Have a booth that you can step into that will not X-ray you, but will detonate any explosive device you may have on you.
It would be a win-win for everyone, and there would be none of this crap about racial profiling!!!!!
Wow, things have gone quite here.
Sad to see that was starting to pass as a political discussion about the actions Sam took, right or wrong vs. the actions of the TSA, and their ‘government charter’ or how it impacts our freedom, has sunken to US and military bashing.
God Bless the USA!
Absolutely — I care very much about our country. That’s why I want the government to stop screwing it up, and start living by the basic standards for decent behavior the rest of do every day.
Hi Mitch
The US government hasn’t fought a defensive war since 1812.
Of course I’m being critical of the military.
God bless the USA? Why would God bless a corporation? Pretty audacious to demand such a thing, if there were a God.
Instead of spouting cliches, look at the real things that the real soldiers are really doing in a purely aggressive conflict. Think about how much blessing such an institution, engaging in such activity, really deserves.
Thanks
Paul, I too want the Government to stop screwing up the country. Smaller and less government is best, but both of the political parties tend to GROW government and not shrink it. Grow debt, not reduce it, and just exist to bash the other party and not really solve any problems. TERM LIMITS for ALL members of Government! That would help, of course if more than 20% of the country would care to vote, that would help too.
I do not believe that the US government must be limited to fight only defensive wars or battles. The best defense is a good offense. If not, we would be speaking German or Russian right now.
That said I do not believe all wars or combat that the US President’s have involved us as a nation in are justified. Well intended or not.
I will call this a fact, but it is my belief. There are people in this big world who want to harm/kill us and destroy our way of life, for no other reason that we do not believe as they do, we act in ways they do not allow, or they are culturally driven to hatred because of past actions of the US Government. (The US Government as an entity has done horrendous things and actions to people of all countries, including our own.)
But, because I live in this great country called the United States of American, which includes government representatives that I have voted for and pay a substantial amount of my income too. I expect the US Government (i.e. Militarily if necessary) to protect me and my family from those that want to harm me.
The trick with that statement, is that in order to be protected, I must be willing to allow the Government to impose a set of balanced laws/rules/policies that will impact my freedoms, but in exchange keep me safer than if they did not exist at all. The hard part is finding the right balance and way to ensure safety, but maintain individual rights.
Also, by expecting the US Government to keep me safe, I have the expectation that it may take military actions upon other countries/people that are actively allowing or participating in the acts of harming US Citizens, both reactively (in response to an attack) and proactively (To prevent and attack).
I do not want another 9-11 attack to take place.
All Government organizations, political parties, military members are made up of individuals. These individuals can have a substantial impact on how laws, rules and policies are enforced, and what may be intended to be reasonable, some ass is on a power trip takes it to an extreme and then everything goes off in the weeds or worse. If they are high up in an organization, the more impact for positive or negative can occur.
God bless the USA is not a demand, it is a request. You appear to not believe in God, I guess your belief is that it all started with one giant big bang, from nothing to this. Ok.
LPViper, what do you believe in? (Serious question here, not trying to attack or demean)
Do you have any spiritual beliefs? Buddhist, (New Age, everyone is god?) Spirits? Atheist?
Do you not believe in the military? or just the use of the military in offensive action? Or humanitarian uses?
Can you describe your Political beliefs? Republican (My guess is no), Democrat, Libertarian, Other?
Do you volunteer or do charity work for any organization? (I was a volunteer Firefighter for 5 years, till I had kids)
Do you vote? Have you run for a political office or participated in protests, or marches?
How would you solve the issues that face us today? We can keep it to Airport security or any other topic?
‘LPViper, what do you believe in?’
The good neighbor rule. You leave me alone, I leave you alone.
‘Do you have any spiritual beliefs?’
Pantheist (what you call New Age) is closest.
‘Do you not believe in the military? or just the use of the military in offensive action? Or humanitarian uses?’
I believe that standing armies are unnecessary. Look at the Revolutionary period. It was argued back then that the government needed to raise an army to ‘protect our borders’, when we had just finished defeating the mightiest military in the world with an all volunteer militia. Government will always scaremonger to try to justify a standing army, because war enriches the State, its workers and their friends. Any humanitarian issue a military could be thought to be needed for can be, and often has, been handled by volunteers and/or mercenaries.
‘Can you describe your Political beliefs?’
Voluntarist is closest. I would like to see violent monopolies eliminated from the Earth so that a real society of men (and women), based on consensual transaction and division of labor, could be realized.
‘Do you volunteer or do charity work for any organization?’
Yes, I do FIJA outreach, volunteer to help out the local government with special projects (I have explained my philosophy to them, they say ‘yes, son, that’s nice), and I volunteer for the Cub Scouts (though without all the genuflection for the flag).
‘Do you vote?’
Yes.
‘Have you run for a political office or participated in protests, or marches?’
I have not run for a political office because I could not swear their oath. I have participated in protests, which honestly fall largely on deaf ears around here. Also, the local ‘libertarians’ seem to have a problem with gay people and Mexicans. I don’t like that bigotry very much, I grew up with it and I don’t need or want any more of it.
‘How would you solve the issues that face us today?’
By considering not only the seen, but the unseen effects of all group actions, and by eliminating the government teat wherever possible and teaching people about doing for one’s self rather than standing around with one’s hand out.
We can get more specific if you want, Mitch. Obviously I am no expert and I learn something new every day, and I love hearing different points of view. I appreciate the civil discourse. You don’t get a whole lot of that around here. By that I mean where I live, not this website(!)
Take Care
Paul, I too want the Government to stop screwing up the country. Smaller and less government is best, but both of the political parties tend to GROW government and not shrink it. Grow debt, not reduce it, and just exist to bash the other party and not really solve any problems.
Absolutely true.
TERM LIMITS for ALL members of Government! That would help,
Maybe a little. I don’t think it would solve the problems. There are enough scumbags in this country to keep the congress occupied for a long time.
of course if more than 20% of the country would care to vote, that would help too.
I suppose it would depend how they vote.
I do not believe that the US government must be limited to fight only defensive wars or battles.
Great, you believe in aggressive war. That’s just peachy. Do you also chuck bombs at your neighbors, or is it just foreigners you’re in favor of murdering?
The best defense is a good offense.
You’re right. I’m grabbing my gun and heading over to the neighbors as we speak. He looked at me funny, and who knows, if I don’t take him out now, he might get me later. Once I kill everyone I think maybe might harm me eventually, then I’ll be really safe.
Well, unless me killing people pisses other people off. I’m sure that won’t happen.
If not, we would be speaking German or Russian right now.
Baloney. WW2 was defensive, and the Russians never had anything close to the capability to invade.
That said I do not believe all wars or combat that the US President’s have involved us as a nation in are justified. Well intended or not.
I don’t see why not, given that you blatantly endorse aggressive killing.
I will call this a fact, but it is my belief. There are people in this big world who want to harm/kill us and destroy our way of life, for no other reason that we do not believe as they do,
A swing and a miss.
we act in ways they do not allow,
Strike two.
or they are culturally driven to hatred because of past actions of the US Government.
It’s a hit!! How would you react if the Chinese set up bases on U.S. soil? How about if they bombed us and constructed no-fly zones. How about if they overthrew our elected leaders and installed their own (see: the shah). Do you think you might be pissed?
But I’m sure if we just blow up a few more innocent families (and call it “collateral damage”), occupy a few more nations, subsidize a few more despots, etc, everything will get all better.
(The US Government as an entity has done horrendous things and actions to people of all countries, including our own.)
Very true. As have other governments. Kind of makes you think governments aren’t a great kind of organization to have running everything.
By the way, I thought you were for small government? Do you think running around the world bombing people, nation building, occupying people’s land, and maintaining 700 bases in 140 countries, is “small government”? Or is it just that you think bureaucracy is magically great as long as the bureaucrats are carrying guns?
But, because I live in this great country called the United States of American, which includes government representatives that I have voted for and pay a substantial amount of my income too. I expect the US Government (i.e. Militarily if necessary) to protect me and my family from those that want to harm me.
You must be very disappointed then. They have done nothing but put us at greater risk. If I were you, I’d want to get my money back, so I could spend it on protection from an agency that could do a good job at a good price. Governments (and forced monopolies in general) are always inefficient and ineffective. Personally, I prefer local militias when it comes to protection, but you should be free to spend your own money the way you want.
Unfortunately, the government steals most of it.
The trick with that statement, is that in order to be protected, I must be willing to allow the Government to impose a set of balanced laws/rules/policies that will impact my freedoms, but in exchange keep me safer than if they did not exist at all. The hard part is finding the right balance and way to ensure safety, but maintain individual rights.
I suggest you figure out what that balance is, and sign a contract with the government, and go live with other similarly minded people. I suggest you leave me out of it. I want nothing to do with ‘em.
I think safety, just like all other goods and services, can be provided most effectively when people are free to choose. Forcing everyone to pay for a one sized fits all solution, provided by a giant bureaucracy, with no competitors, is a bad idea. It’s a bad idea for other services (medical care, schools, retirement, etc), and it’s a bad idea for defense.
It’s also immoral.
Also, by expecting the US Government to keep me safe, I have the expectation that it may take military actions upon other countries/people that are actively allowing or participating in the acts of harming US Citizens,
If a person has attacked someone else, they should be held accountable. That doesn’t mean occupy their country, and blow up the neighborhoods of all their friends.
both reactively (in response to an attack) and proactively (To prevent and attack).
Again, you endorse aggressive violence, which makes you the attacker.
I do not want another 9-11 attack to take place.
Then I suggest your “government” stop occupying other countries, and blowing up innocent people, which was the direct cause of the first 9-11 attack.
Some decent security might be nice too. You know, security not provided by federal bureaucrats.
All Government organizations, political parties, military members are made up of individuals. These individuals can have a substantial impact on how laws, rules and policies are enforced, and what may be intended to be reasonable, some ass is on a power trip takes it to an extreme and then everything goes off in the weeds or worse. If they are high up in an organization, the more impact for positive or negative can occur.
How about this: You have a right to live your life and use your finances as you choose, as long as you don’t harm anyone else. If you want to pay for global murdering sprees, go for it, but stop forcing me to do so.
God bless the USA is not a demand, it is a request. You appear to not believe in God, I guess your belief is that it all started with one giant big bang, from nothing to this. Ok.
I believe in God.
LPViper, what do you believe in? (Serious question here, not trying to attack or demean)
I’ll answer these too, just FYE. I’ve gone this far, after all .
Do you have any spiritual beliefs? Buddhist, (New Age, everyone is god?) Spirits? Atheist?
I’m a Christian.
Do you not believe in the military? or just the use of the military in offensive action? Or humanitarian uses?
I believe local militias, who join together in case of general attack, would be much preferable to a standing army. This is actually much closer to the constitutional approach.
Can you describe your Political beliefs? Republican (My guess is no), Democrat, Libertarian, Other?
I’d call myself a libertarian, although there are a lot of people who also use that term who I would disagree with on a number of issues. Voluntaryist is pretty close too, as lp said.
Basically, I believe the initiation of aggressive violence is wrong. The only justifiable use of violence is defense against the aggression of others.
Do you volunteer or do charity work for any organization? (I was a volunteer Firefighter for 5 years, till I had kids)
Yes, I do tech work and coffee at church. I’ve volunteer taught and tutored in the past, and I’d like to do more, but I’m very busy. Also lots of random work days, soup kitchens, etc. This question kind of seems like an invitation to brag though — I’m not sure if I’m comfortable with it.
Do you vote?
Yes.
Have you run for a political office
No. I may at some point, but I’m concerned about the oath as well. I wonder why I must swear allegiance to the U.S. government in order to participate in town or state politics. So much for respecting “the will of the people”.
or participated in protests, or marches?
Yes.
How would you solve the issues that face us today? We can keep it to Airport security or any other topic?
Again, I believe people should be free to make their own choices about their lives and finances, as long as they don’t harm others. Jamming everyone into one sized fits all solutions, and the corporatism, corruption, and giant government bureaucracy that this entails, is the source of most of our political and economic problems today, as well as more personal conflict than most people probably realize.
If you believe in something, support it yourself, and try to convince me to support it as well — don’t advance your goals by jamming a gun in my back and extracting money from me, or forcing my participation. People need to respect the choices of their neighbors.
I’m surprised no one brought this up to Mitch the government has no responsibility to keep you safe (or give you anything) the courts have said many times that the government can ignore your pleas for help any time they want and there is nothing you can do about it.
Paul and LPViper thank you for your responses.
Paul, do you intend to insult me with your responses, or is it just a passionate reply? Just trying to keep things civil here, and LPVipers response was quite nice, direct and to the point… My respect increased significately for him(her?). Paul, yours has a different tone, and I want to make sure I am reading it right.
Just to put myself out there a little as well:
I am Christian, and conservative… (Guess you couldn’t guess that.) But, I do not consider myself a far right type of guy, I am in the middle, Pro Choice, I have a good friend who is gay.
I really think the two party system is broke right now… and the term limits was just a glimmer of hope to start things in the right direction.
I have not served in the military, but my father and brother-in-law have as well as a host of other family members.
I vote, and have never run for office, most likely never will. I have no problem with the oath of office, for we the people have let this problem develop over time and now it is up to us to solve it.
What I hope here, is to find different minded people and have a sharing of views, hopefully without attacking each other, or insulting each other and see what comes from it.
And, Vix, I hold no illusions about what the Government is really capable of doing or not, but in a very broad way, they do pretend to be protecting the citizens of the US.
Final question, what area of the country do you live in, big assumption that you are in the US. West, East, North Central, South Central… I am in the South Central…
I live in Metro Detroit. Being as how I only live a few minutes from an international border, there’s a whole mess of bureaucracy up here. Unemployment is rampant. I have a job and keep getting asked how I do it, and the simple answer is I travel to better places than this. People are living off unemployment stipends from the state, then pouring the money back into local coffers in the form of property tax, all so we can fund every teacher, secretary, bus driver and janitor that has worked for ‘our’ schools for the last 50 plus odd years. Where is the incentive for people around here to pick up the slack? Where is the business climate for a manufacturer to set up his procduction/assembly operations? The answer is they aren’t anywhere around. The government handed all the favors out to all the biggest outfits years ago, and left the semi skilled laborers in this country holding the effing bag. That’s why I want these government monsters gone from us. They are so evil, so diabolical, so shrewd, that my grandparents in law, some of the hardest working smartest people I know, have lost probably 75% of the buying power of their money in the last few decades, have had to sell all their secondary homes to afford one nice one, and are taking a beating on all their investments in taxes and inflation. But they continue to just eat the flag waving, god bless america BS right up, even when they’re bent right over for the world to see. That’s why I oppose this. This twisting of good American people into money machines and vassals for the State is disgusting, immoral, and outrageous. I’m even getting to the point where I find a lack of outrage over it to be outrageous in itself. So there’s my manifesto, not trying to be a jerk, I don’t have to be, I’ll just ‘splain the best I can and have a take and not suck and all that good stuff
Be well
Obama Administration Awarded Hundreds of Thousands in Airport Grants to Stupak’s District Two Days Before Vote
Was this Yet Another Backroom Deal to Force Obama’s Bill Down the American People’s Throats?
Three airports in the district of infamous fence-sitting and ultimately kowtowing Democrat Bart Stupak were awarded $726,409 in grants by the Obama Administration just two days before a vote on Obama and Pelosi’s government takeover of healthcare.
Did Stupak compromise his supposed principled stand against taxpayer funding of abortion in exchange for taxpayer dollars for pet projects?
Alpena County Regional Airport received a $85,500 grant, but had only 7,519 passenger boardings in 2008 (the most recent year for which there is information) according to Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) data. Alpena County Regional Airport serves fewer passengers than even the late Rep. John Murtha’s famous “Airport for Nobody.”
Delta County Airport has even less customers than that, but still received a $179,209 grant.
Chippewa County International Airport received a $461,700 grant, but had only 13,733 passenger boardings in 2008.
Will Stupak come clean about this apparent backroom deal for his vote?
Call Stupak’s district office at (989) 356-0690 and ask.
Airport device follows fliers’ phones
By Thomas Frank, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Today’s smartphones and PDAs could have a new use in the nation’s airports: helping passengers avoid long lines at security checkpoints.
The Transportation Security Administration is looking at installing devices in airports that home in and detect personal electronic equipment. The aim is to track how long people are stuck in security lines.
Information about wait times could then be posted on websites and in airports across the country.
“This technology will produce valuable data that can be used in a variety of ways,” TSA spokeswoman Lauren Gaches said, noting it could help prevent checkpoint snarls.
But civil-liberties experts worry that such a system enables the government to track people’s whereabouts. “It’s serious business when the government begins to get near people’s personal-communication devices,” said American Civil Liberties Union privacy expert Jay Stanley.
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/wireless/2010-03-23-cellphones_N.htm
Stupak is a scumbag. I’ve done some running around for his Libertarian opponent up here, but no go so far. My so called representative voted against health fascism, so there’s one point in her favor, anyway. All that money the government is sending to the northern lower (basically a wilderness with a town here and there) is ridiculous. If capital had needed to be invested up there, people would be doing it themselves. More displacement of labor, more reallocation of resources away from the proper market mechanism, more suffering for those of us that work for a living and are extorted by these government people, for what they know is best for us. I want to peuk, and thanks for the heads up, I will call Mr. Stupak and let him know there’s a Ron Paul Republican up in his district that’s gonna eat his lunch.
This is why the satellite detectrion switch in my phone is always set to off unless I need it for something specific
Again, thanks for the heads up, and don’t forget to empty out your 401k accounts before the socio-fascists in government steal those, too. They’re talking about it
Paul and LPViper thank you for your responses.
And thank you
Paul, do you intend to insult me with your responses, or is it just a passionate reply? Just trying to keep things civil here, and LPVipers response was quite nice, direct and to the point… My respect increased significately for him(her?). Paul, yours has a different tone, and I want to make sure I am reading it right.
I don’t intend to insult you, but your endorsement of aggressive war is very offensive to me. You are endorsing the killing of innocent people.
Just to put myself out there a little as well:
I am Christian, and conservative… (Guess you couldn’t guess that.) But, I do not consider myself a far right type of guy, I am in the middle,
I find left/right can be kind of inadequate to describe people sometimes.
Pro Choice, I have a good friend who is gay.
I’m actually pro-life, which might surprise you, after the fetus/baby has a pulse and brain waves. After that point I consider them a person.
I don’t think the government should be involved in defining marriage at all — have whatever ceremony you want, call it whatever you want, and let others call it what they want.
I really think the two party system is broke right now…
and the term limits was just a glimmer of hope to start things in the right direction.
I’d support term limits — but I see nullification as a brighter glimmer. We need to increase state independence.
I have not served in the military, but my father and brother-in-law have as well as a host of other family members.
I vote, and have never run for office, most likely never will. I have no problem with the oath of office, for we the people have let this problem develop over time and now it is up to us to solve it.
I don’t understand your last statement — how does the fact that we’ve let the problem grow and that we need to fix it makes you OK with the oath?
What I hope here, is to find different minded people and have a sharing of views, hopefully without attacking each other, or insulting each other and see what comes from it.
It’s good to branch out, and very mature of you .
And, Vix, I hold no illusions about what the Government is really capable of doing or not, but in a very broad way, they do pretend to be protecting the citizens of the US.
Lol, they certainly pretend to do so. And, they actually do to an extent — police and fire often do actually help people who are in trouble.
Final question, what area of the country do you live in, big assumption that you are in the US. West, East, North Central, South Central… I am in the South Central…
I’m from New Hampshire, but I currently live in LA.
Reading all this was exhausting, particularly the blind patriotism and support for foreign interventions, militarily.
There is no justification for messing with the autonomy of foreign peoples and as history has shown, it’s ineffective in the long run and worse yet at the onset.
As an American abroad I would not think twice about bringing equal force against the aggressors of my friends, family, or children in particular… by any soldier or representative of any nation or flag.
Patriotism is crap, and it’s a sign of weakness. As I’ve mentioned to my brothers and sisters in the Armed Forces on numerous occasions, while I love em and will always break bread with them, there may come a day instead when necks will require breaking and I wouldn’t.. couldn’t in good conscience make the distinction of family or aggressing soldier. I hope they come to their senses, grab their pitchforks, and get back to the harvest sooner than later.
TO: “TUMBLEWEED2: If you haven’t heard of them, or their site, please check out “OATHKEEPERS.org, and “L.E.A.P.”…Sure, they both have their faults, but I think they both do far, far, far more good than harm. Like politics and war, fighting for freedom sometimes produces strange bedmates!..AND, to all of you: *CHILL OUT*! RELAX! Have a drink / puff / pill / cup of tea or coffee, a soda, juice, whatever floats your boat…After a hard days’ activism, it is good to sit and reflect, and be glad and grateful that we still have what little freedom we still have left. And even if that freedom, our God-given, FedCon *PROTECTED* freedom is reduced to nothing more than a seed…Remember, from the tiniest acorn grows the mighty oak tree! GARDEN SEASON, PEOPLE! SPRING IS HERE! HOPE SPRINGS ETERNAL! OBAMA is still President. Oh well. Orwell???…*grin*…*I SUPPORT THE ONGOING MILITARY COUP*…
You sort of lost me with the secret speak. I\’m aware of Leap and Oathkeepers, and I share some sentiments but not many.
I\’m not sure what your intended meaning or theme was, aside from plugging two organizations of many.
Peace
TUMBLEWEED2: Just in case you hadn’t heard of LEAP & oathkeepers, that’s all…just wanted to get more variety of voices / opinions into the mix – as many different voices into the conversation…that’s all…the “secret speak”???…that’s mostly mumbo-jumbo, & B.S…..Mostly…(I’m supposed to write that. It’s on the script delivered to me by courier today, from General D’issahrray, over at COMPAC / DELLTA QUADRANT)……I’m a DI for the USMC…that is, Disinformation Instigator, for the Universal Salvation Mother Church….I also do some UCMJ work…that only means I repair Underwater Communication Module Junctions, ah, crap. I loved my job. I hate having to retire. 62, 62, 62! I just had to contract for an age 62 CAP! crap. I coulda’ stayed in till *72*, NOW!…oh, well……..anyone for tennis???…
first off you are a dick, why are you really bothering video taping security especially TSA. If you think TSA is Security theatre then lets go back to when it was people coudlnt even take scissors on the plans and a nail clipper. Although there is always a possiblity that might happen. I think we all need to do our part on the plane. TSA is only ment to intimidate the terrorist from trying to do another 9/11 and hopefully when the day comes that a terrorist do decide to try the system TSA will catch them and if not well god help us all. But after one TSA agent told an ignorant prick like yourself when i was flying: “When the plane goes down, you will see”. If you want TSA gone start legislation…
first off you are a dick, why are you really bothering video taping security especially TSA.
Sam can speak for himself, but I’d say the fact that TSA is harassing innocent people, blatantly violating their fourth amendment rights, and extorting money from me to do it, is reason enough.
If you think TSA is Security theatre then lets go back to when it was people coudlnt even take scissors on the plans and a nail clipper.
Uh … that stupid rule was also TSA.
I think we all need to do our part on the plane. TSA is only ment to intimidate the terrorist from trying to do another 9/11 and hopefully when the day comes that a terrorist do decide to try the system TSA will catch them and if not well god help us all.
Yes, god help us all that the only thing standing in between us and terrorists is the joke that is TSA. They harass grandmothers for having too much toothpaste, but routinely let actual test bombs right though.
If we wanted real security, we’d let the airlines handle it. Want an airline that strips everyone to their undies, in order to make you feel safe? Go for it. Want an airline where you can maintain privacy, at perhaps slightly more risk to yourself? Also your choice.
Given that I actually value freedom, and do not live my life terrified of some vague threat, I know which one I’d take. More people die every month in this country in auto accidents than died on 9/11. It’s a bunch of fear-mongering, in order to get us to give up our rights and privacy.
Also, they’d probably let pilots and flight crews have guns — if they’d done that in the first place, 9/11 would never have happened.
Instead, we’re stuck with a one size fits all “solution” jammed down all our throats — government agents viewing nude photos of us and our children, and harassing us over toothpaste. Its absolutely abusive, absurd, outrageous, unconstitutional, and immoral.
But after one TSA agent told an ignorant prick like yourself when i was flying: “When the plane goes down, you will see”.
Yes, we’ll see that yet another incompetent federal agency failed miserably yet again, and was too busy viewing pictures of naked kids, or harassing someone over having the wrong size baggie, to do any real security work.
If you want TSA gone start legislation…
Yeah right. The people in congress want more power — Rs or Ds. They’d give everyone full cavity searches if they could get away with it.
I think videotaping, to show the absolute absurdity, waste, and abuse of the giant bureaucracy that is TSA, is a fine way to effect change. One wonders, if they’re so proud of the job they do, why so many government agents hate cameras so much?
Wow-how did this get stirred up again??Bunch if ignorant pricks!paul-what about baggie sizes!? LOLIs that a 1 quart bag,or just half of a 2 quart bag??We would go back to when we couldn’t take scissors or nail clippers on a plane??That is today,you still can’t! Why bother to post incomprehensible gibberish? It doesn’t help to start by calling someone an ignoranr prick-how do you know if he is ignorant or not?? —bil
Post your comment below. Login in the far right column to get rid of CAPTCHA. If you want a pic to show with your comment, go get a gravatar!
Want to discuss rather than just comment? Visit the Free Keene Forum.
Supporters of FK
Recent Forum Topics- Keene City Council Contact Info February 8, 2012
- Pledged Free-stater heading to "The Shire" later this year February 8, 2012
- FBI is watching February 7, 2012
- New February 7, 2012
- Free Minds Radio 02/05/2012 February 5, 2012
- HELP . . . Still unable to access . . . February 5, 2012
- Marijuana decrim bills up for vote February 5, 2012
- Episode 35 - Anarch-Elitism February 5, 2012
- HB 1533 -- fines for hurting legislators' feelings February 4, 2012
- HB 1494 -- "Your papers, please" February 4, 2012
- Recent Forum Posts
- Re: Keene City Council Contact Info February 9, 2012
- Re: What I wrote to the Chief of Police in town of Weare February 9, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam Dodson February 9, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam Dodson February 9, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam Dodson February 8, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam and New angle on trolling? Hmm. February 8, 2012
- Re: Bearcat petition at city council meeting February 8, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam Dodson February 8, 2012
- Re: Keene City Council Contact Info February 8, 2012
- Re: What is the latest on Sam and New angle on trolling? Hmm. February 8, 2012