Free Keene Blogger, Ian Freeman, Caged for 90 Days
Facebook Update from Pete Voluntaryist Eyre:
“Today “judge” Arnold ordered Ian caged for 90 days for sitting in front of the vehicle that over a year ago held Heika Courser (who was cuffed for a victimless action). Ian’s request to remain free until his appeal was heard was denied. He also has 270days suspended for 2yrs.”
More information coming from witnesses of today’s events.
Comments
118 Comments on Free Keene Blogger, Ian Freeman, Caged for 90 Days
You neglected to mention that this was trial by jury…it wasn’t just the judge who thought his actions were unacceptable.
He feels like his dick is three feet long, that’s how he feels.
I hope Ian gets out soon, nobody needs to be caged for sitting in front of a cop car.
Gimme a break, holy. You know better than 99% of the country, simply by virtue of where you live, that the jurors have been coerced into being robot readers for the legislature. What an asinine statement. Who did Ian hurt? Huh?
I never said Ian hurt anyone…I said that the jurors (aka, people from Keene) also found his actions unacceptable and something that they don’t want to be present in their community.
So they caged him within their community at their own expense?
I’m shocked that you people can even fuel your own cars
“So they caged him within their community at their own expense?”
Some people think it’s worth spending money to ensure that the community measures up to certain expectations. The jury’s decision reflects that.
lpviper – just a few weeks ago people were praising the jury in Pete and Adam’s case, but now they are a bunch of fools and robots?
Well, matt, one jury let people go that weren’t hurting anybody, and the other caged a man who didn’t hurt anybody.
One is right and the other is wrong. Do you need the cliffs notes version? I don’t know how to say it in ‘ug’
Oh. Well well well. Aren’t you the humorous snarky one. This jury didn’t cage Ian – that isn’t there responsibility and/or duty; the judge did that. And here I thought you were good at filling up cars with gas.
Some people think it’s worth spending money to ensure that the community measures up to certain expectations. The jury’s decision reflects that.
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these ‘some people’ are acting immorally, holy. It is wrong to cause hurt to someone who hasn’t harmed anyone else. Period.
Suppose I and a few of my closest padres decided that you were just annoyingly fucking loud and we decided to throw you in a cage for a few months, because ‘that’ll teach you to shut the hell up’. Wrong, isn’t it? well, this is NO different, and if you can’t see that, I feel sorry for you.
Just because cops and ‘judges’ do it under color of law, and a few ‘peers’ (carefully selected by judges and lawyers, might I add; if you want to nullify you have to SNEAK onto a jury to do your job) follow the instructions given them by the Robeded One, that doesn’t make it right, and that doesn’t make it moral.
Have you ever heard of the Golden Rule, holy? Mean anything to you? I’m starting to taste bile in the back of my throat (not Bile of Blog of Bile, sorry Bile), so I think I’ll go take some air.
You’re disgusting, holy
matt on Wed, 10th Aug 2011 11:02 pm
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Oh. Well well well. Aren’t you the humorous snarky one. This jury didn’t cage Ian – that isn’t there responsibility and/or duty; the judge did that. And here I thought you were good at filling up cars with gas.
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You’re picking at me over diction. Gimme a break here. The judge put the man in the cage because the jury found him guilty based on immoral instruction from the judge. Is that really all you have? Because that wasn’t a refutation, it was an English Diction class.
UG UG UG UG! See? Hard to be expressive that way
“Suppose I and a few of my closest padres decided that you were just annoyingly fucking loud and we decided to throw you in a cage for a few months, because ‘that’ll teach you to shut the hell up’. Wrong, isn’t it? well, this is NO different, and if you can’t see that, I feel sorry for you.”
If I stood in front of your car/sat on it, refusing to let you drive,I think you would absolutely have the right to let me know that this is not acceptable behavior.
“You’re disgusting, holy”
Aw, I’ve always thought you were such a darling little flower, vipe.
Judging by HolyCanole’s comments, I can make a good guess that people in Keene are growing tired of the “civ-dis” antics. Yes, police are brutal thugs who deserve all the flack they get, but come on, do you really think you’re diminishing the authority of the cops simply by resisting arrest or standing in front of their police cars? And let’s face it: Ian can do something like this in Keene can come out without a scratch (I agree that three months in jail is a bit harsh though); if he and other keeniacs were doing these kinds of things in a city like Boston – where police brutality is the norm – the results would have probably been ten times as violent. If three months in a cage or taking your camera is the worst the cops in NH will do, then you should consider them pretty damn peaceful as far as cops go. And this is coming from someone who has dealt with police in Boston, Los Angeles, New York, Baltimore, and DC.
The resentment that native Keene residents (as well as other NH residents such as myself) have towards the free states and/or keeniacs has nothing to do with “statism”; it has to do with them not wanting their towns being turned into a rothbardian experiment at *their* expense, regardless as to how they feel about right-libertarian politics. I mean, they’re the ones who are feeling the heat from the activism, not the state (which is simply going to raise taxes on NH residents to pay for free stater jail time). Like I’ve been saying on here forever, why can’t the free staters devote most of their time towards actions which do good for locals as well as towards anti-state goals? Set up alternative economies, create free schools, set up clinics that provide free medical marijuana to people who need it, etc. etc. There is so much that people who have the desire to create a stateless society could do which won’t involve taping cops.
(This is Julia Riber Pitt, by the way.)
No I won’t give you a break here. You’re being an asshole and you know it. You’re pissed that Ian got thrown in the clink, which I understand – but that has nothing to do with the jury – nor does it have anything to do with me. Maybe instead of thinking up your next one liner, you write a letter to the judge – or, at the very least, communicate with the people you feel are responsible for this caging in some fashion. It isn’t me.
matt on Wed, 10th Aug 2011 11:15 pm
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No I won’t give you a break here. You’re being an asshole and you know it. You’re pissed that Ian got thrown in the clink, which I understand – but that has nothing to do with the jury – nor does it have anything to do with me. Maybe instead of thinking up your next one liner, you write a letter to the judge – or, at the very least, communicate with the people you feel are responsible for this caging in some fashion. It isn’t me.
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Whatever, bud. I’m not pissed about Ian. I don’t even like Ian, he’s annoying to me. I’m pissed that you think it’s ok that a man be caged for sitting in front of an automobile! Your tacit approval, and that of others who sanction aggression like this with their silence or obedience, it matters not which, is enabling these criminals to victimize people.
I think you done lost your fuckin mind bro
Peace, love, understanding, tolerance.
I feel myself slipping because I am so angered by your callousness and your refusal to utilize the Golden Rule
Peace be with you
Like I’ve been saying on here forever, why can’t the free staters devote most of their time towards actions which do good for locals as well as towards anti-state goals? Set up alternative economies, create free schools, set up clinics that provide free medical marijuana to people who need it, etc. etc. There is so much that people who have the desire to create a stateless society could do which won’t involve taping cops.
(This is Julia Riber Pitt, by the way.)
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Julia, that stuff is all illegal. The cops will be coming. Then what?
Well said, Julia.
I think Ian receiving such a harsh sentence reflects the fact that the general Keene community fosters at least some amount of resentment towards him/Free Keene. Say what you will about the ‘morality’ of condemning someone for mere resentment, but I am a firm believer in learning how to be a part of a community. If the people in this movement made more of an effort to engage with the locals in less abrasive ways (ie not using megaphones outside the middle school, or smoking pot and drinking beer topless downtown and in city meetings) perhaps the jury and/or judge would be more sympathetic in cases such as this.
I mean, wouldn’t it be great for the movement if you EVER saw locals out there in support of Free Keene causes? The fact that you don’t, and that you actually quite often see/hear people’s strong resentment towards their presence here, should indicate that something’s not right. It has nothing to do with whether or not they are ‘peaceful’ in their actions, but rather if they make an effort to work WITH the community…not just fight it.
I’ve been saying this for about a year now…it’s the whole reason why I started the ‘Free Keene from the Free Keene Stigma’ group last summer. I may have my own opinions on the things Free Keene fights for–and I’ll admit that I enjoy coming here to practice my debate skills and such–but mainly I’m upset with the way they have chosen to essentially move to Keene with the sole purpose of complaining about how it is run. Ian assured me time and time again that he would try to make an effort to listen more to the feedback of locals, but I certainly didn’t see any manifestation of that effort over the year. Perhaps when he gets out after the 90 days he’ll reconsider.
Lpviper: I know anarchists in Boston, Providence, and Baltimore who have set up free schools and free preschools which are organized non-hierarchically and which don’t involve the state in any way. Traditionally speaking, market anarchists have mostly gone the route of building alternative institutions to fight against the state (and capitalism). I only brought up medical weed because weed legalization is something a lot of free staters care about, so 1 + 1 = 2.
Let me amplify a tad, Matt. It was inaccurate to say I wasn’t pissed about Ian, I am, I would be about anybody in his spot. That’s where I’m coming from on that. I even think Ian and I might be friends someday if I grow up and he gets over himself a bit lol
That’s a dodge, Julia. What happens when the cops come?
Why are the freetards claiming that obstructing traffic is a victimless action? It’s absolutely not. I’ve lived in Latin America, and I’ve seen how much chaos numerically insignificant factions with grievances are able to cause through roadblocks and obstructing traffic. A small group of radicals with an incomprehensible ideology (like the Free Keene Cult) or nihilists can shut down the economic activity of an entire region using this tactic. Obstructing traffic in the road in the name of a political cause IS NOT A VICTIMLESS ACT. Ian seems to think he’s Jesus. I’m skeptical, but I guess we’ll have to wait until he does something really drastic in the name of his political ideals to find out. But look on the bright side, Free Culters–Playing cards in general pop for 90 days isn’t nearly as painful as being crucified, is it? Bet ya didn’t see it that way, did ya? So this is actually a good thing! Ian gets to be martyred, and Ian doesn’t have to be nailed to anything! Win-win!!!!
El Oh El. You getting all asshurt over comments on a free forum. That’s funnyI. I’d hate to spill a glass of milk in your house. Well, go log off, take a vicodin and fall asleep; things will be brighter in the morning K? BTW – I have not stated in any fashion that I approve of Ian being jailed. You’re making an assumption. You’re steering this boat in a whole new direction – I merely commented on juries.
but I am a firm believer in learning how to be a part of a community.
…. and a firm believer in using violence against those who choose to live in a way the “community” (ie: you) disapproves of.
Oh, christ, here we go again, I wasn’t talking about THIS, I was talking about THAT, you started a whole new conversation, bladda bladda bla.
You talked me into it Matt. Later!!
Holy_Canole: much thanks. I’ve always felt that if any kind of anti-state revolution would happen, it would *have* to rely on the strength of communities to hold it up. Simply cutting off the head of the state without having alternative, community-based institutions in place will simply lead to a lot of hell, or the state coming back in a different form. But if communities can come together and resist the state *together* then good things will happen.
When I first heard about the FSP back in 2009, I was very resentful, because I knew that serious tension would arise between the free staters and the native NHites who might not fully agree with their agenda. I have enough Palestinian friends to know what happens to people whose cities and towns become the site of some political migration movement. The key to preventing conflict is solidarity between movers and locals. Do the mutual aid thing.
“…. and a firm believer in using violence against those who choose to live in a way the “community” disapproves of.”
No, a firm believer in the notion that people like Ian are adults, and should be able to conduct themselves as such. Sitting on someone’s car and refusing to let them drive warrants consequences…regardless of who’s car it is.
As I said above, I agree that 3 months in jail is a harsh price to pay, but that’s reflective of the fact that Ian, in many ways, has not been kind to the community, so why should they be kind in return? Didn’t someone mention something about the Golden Rule before…?
Funny, a cop stopped my car the other day and kept me for 5 minutes, and I ended up late for wherever the hell I was going too, just like that policeman.
Believe it or not the cop isn’t heading off the jail for three months.
This is happening for one reason, because he annoyed the state, and the state is lashing out in the way that only the state can.
Bastards, every last thieving one of them.
This is why I refuse to pay taxes, because I won’t contribute to this kind of victimisation of the honest by the brutal
Perhaps when he gets out after the 90 days he’ll reconsider.
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I take back taking back the ‘hot’ thing.
You’re fucking twisted
“This is happening for one reason, because he annoyed the state, and the state is lashing out in the way that only the state can.”
Again…it was trial by jury, not just by ‘State.’
Thank you Aless, sanity in the morass!
I’mma go pack up n take my children on vacation. Which I am ‘free’ to do because I paid the vehicle registration fee, and the mandatory vehicle insurance, and the driver ‘licensing’ fee.
It would have been a nicer vacation if I hadn’t had to shell out all that dough for picture cards and stickers (for the record I would buy insurance regardless), but you SICKOS don’t give a red fuck about that, do you holy? Matt? Ng?
Ugh
@ lpviper – Yeah no kidding here we go again fucking idiot. That is the golden rule…..when someone does not say something, you don’t say that they did, at least if you want to have a mutually respectful conversation. You can poo poo it until your gas tank is filled up, but I didn’t say anything about being happy with ian being jailed. Be done with it then “Viper” -
The ‘state’ selected and instructed the jury, holy. stop twisting it to fit whatever makes your masters look best
No, a firm believer in the notion that people like Ian are adults, and should be able to conduct themselves as such. Sitting on someone’s car and refusing to let them drive warrants consequences…regardless of who’s car it is.
Would it have warranted consequences if Ian did it during the civil rights era when a police vehicle was departing with a Jim Crow arrest? Would you have supported that?
Do you ever consider that without people like Ian pushing back at the loss of freedom that the clip in which it happens would be much faster? Aren’t you glad there are people willing to push back?
I pushed back at the border and was locked up for it. Did my actions “warrant consequences?”
I am, matt. If you aren’t happy about Ian being jailed, what are you? A sea sponge?
What’s absolutely ridiculous is that it wouldn’t surprise me if the arrest of Heika cost the state over $100,000.
When you factor in the cost of keeping people in jail (supposedly $100/day), and the fact that as well as Ian several other activists spent time in jail, add in the cost of the courts, the judge the prosecuting attorney who probably get paid at least $100/hour, the police who made all the arrests etc and the people at the police department and prosecutors who prepared the cases.
As long as some activists are always committed enough to make these sacrifices the state will soon realise that they can’t afford to enforce these laws.
We all owe a debt of gratitude to Ian and the other activists who are willing to go to jail for a cause rather than taking the easy option of repeatedly paying fines and standing by while others are arrested.
These guys are heroes
That’s right Viper, myself, ng and holy created the registration laws – it’s all our fault. Keep typing…..you’re really making a difference here.
“The ‘state’ selected and instructed the jury, holy. stop twisting it to fit whatever makes your masters look best”
Wasn’t Pete and Ademo’s jury state selected and instructed as well?
LOL I love you guys. You’re so sick and you think it’s so great, that society is controlled in this fashion and people are caged and caged and caged over all this ridiculousness.
Justify it to your grandchildren, Matt. I’ll be able to look mine in the eye, will you?
Peace be with you
lp – you’ll be done with it when you stop replying with a question mark at the end of your sentence. But you can keep hitting refresh and hope that I say things that I didn’t say if it makes you more drowsy. You can’t resist replying – it really is driving you nuts. LMAO.
Yes, holy. What of it? I’m done discussing who picked the damn jury. A is A. Ian in a cage for sitting in front of a car being driven by someone who was being kidnapped is WRONG. K?
Justify it to your grandchildren, Matt. I’ll be able to look mine in the eye, will you?
Peace be with you
Holy_Canole: I get the feeling that Ian holds a sense of entitlement (which isn’t that unusual for most right-libertarians to hold, from my experience anyway) where he *assumes* that he’s entitled to say and do whatever he wants and not have to suffer the consequences. Don’t get me wrong, I’m in full agreement that laws and prisons solve nothing or very, very little, but a basic rule of any society is that you can’t just go around treating others around you like crap and think that they won’t react negatively in some way.
Brad: I highly doubt the comparison you’re making between resisting blatantly discriminatory laws works in this case. The Keeniacs purposely seek out trouble when there is none (or at least hardly any of it). A friend of mine who has lived in Keene for something like 10 years told me that Free Keene was the best thing to have ever happened to the Keene police, because before FK showed up the cops had nothing to do. Now every other week they’re arresting someone for “civil disobedience” and have thus become more active around Keene. In an ironic way, don’t you think that the Keeniacs’ antics will result in the Keene police becoming more powerful when the goal was to challenge their authority and make them less powerful?
Waaa waaa waaa. Lock his whiny ass up and leave it there! Being Ian should be a felony.
‘Peace be with you’…..knock it off. This self righteousness of yours on a comment forum is tantamount to a God complex. ‘I’ll be able to look them in the eye. Will you’ – as if you have imparted sage wisdom for me to reflect upon. STFU. Go to bed – Jeez.
Justify it to your grandchildren, Matt. I’ll be able to look mine in the eye, will you?
If this doesn’t go the liberty way, we will have a worse police state than we do now when we are old and our grandchildren are growing up. What will you tell them you did to stop the madness, Matt? I say peace be with you because I mean it. I want peace for everybody. I haven’t even been in a fist fight in 25 years. Peace is all the time though, Matt, not just when ‘officials’ with fine hats say it is.
thanks
“Would it have warranted consequences if Ian did it during the civil rights era when a police vehicle was departing with a Jim Crow arrest? Would you have supported that?”
As Julia already pointed out…the laws Ian and co. fight against pale in comparison to those of the Civil Rights activists. There’s a HUGE different in fighting *actual* tyranny, and making up scenarios to try to prove tyranny exists where it doesn’t.
The next time Ian gets sprayed down with a fire hose, or beaten with w nightstick for standing in the way of a cop car, you let me know, and then we can discuss whether or not his treatment was warranted.
So as for your question: I apologize, my previous wording was poor. I should not have said that sitting on a car necessarily *warrants* consequences. Consequences should be expected (and they certainly were in the CR era) but whether or not they are warranted depends on what it is you are fighting for.
“Do you ever consider that without people like Ian pushing back at the loss of freedom that the clip in which it happens would be much faster? Aren’t you glad there are people willing to push back?”
Aren’t I glad that there are people willing to whine that their friends can’t get drunk downtown? Not really.
“I pushed back at the border and was locked up for it. Did my actions “warrant consequences?”
I don’t know what ‘pushed back at the border’ means.
What can I say I did to stop the madness? I can say I didn’t go down to the public square, smoke pot, blow it in cops faces, scream pig at them, stand in front of police cars, pass dope to high school kids (a 10th grader no less) in the lobby of the PD (all of this chronicled on their own posted videos) or carrying banners outside of my kids school saying “School Sucks” – when if none of that ever occurred in the first place, would have been an extraordinarily peaceful day in Keene. I have peace in Keene. I work, shop, walk and bike all over Keene without any sort of local government intrusion. So having said that, I don’t need your wish for peace in between your sarcastic and often spiteful insults. But thanks anyway?
Julia,
“I get the feeling that Ian holds a sense of entitlement (which isn’t that unusual for most right-libertarians to hold, from my experience anyway) where he *assumes* that he’s entitled to say and do whatever he wants and not have to suffer the consequences.”
Absolutely. I feel as if this is a general trend in the Free Keene/FSP/right-winged libertarian movement as well. I for one believe that there is certainly more complexity and intricacies in life/being part of a community than simply “don’t touch me or my stuff.” You have to be willing to make concessions and compromises to an extent…and yes, that may respecting the fact that Keene is full of families who don’t necessarily want to walk through central square and have their kids catching secondhand pot fumes. I don’t think that’s really too much to ask–and I think most reasonable members of the Keene community agree.
“Don’t get me wrong, I’m in full agreement that laws and prisons solve nothing or very, very little, but a basic rule of any society is that you can’t just go around treating others around you like crap and think that they won’t react negatively in some way.”
Again, agreed. I think it would be much better if they had Ian out there sweeping the streets, or trimming some bushes downtown than simply sitting in a cell. I think that would be better for the community as well.
“I have peace in Keene. I work, shop, walk and bike all over Keene without any sort of local government intrusion.”
Yup.
Yes, I can wish you peace and still spitefully insult you.
You’re Welcome
matt on Thu, 11th Aug 2011 12:21 am
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What can I say I did to stop the madness? I can say I didn’t go down to the public square, smoke pot, blow it in cops faces, scream pig at them, stand in front of police cars, pass dope to high school kids (a 10th grader no less) in the lobby of the PD (all of this chronicled on their own posted videos) or carrying banners outside of my kids school saying “School Sucks” – when if none of that ever occurred in the first place, would have been an extraordinarily peaceful day in Keene. I have peace in Keene. I work, shop, walk and bike all over Keene without any sort of local government intrusion. So having said that, I don’t need your wish for peace in between your sarcastic and often spiteful insults. But thanks anyway?
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HaHa all you can say is what you didn’t do. An impressive resume. History will show who made the better choice.
Good luck on that
@viper. Much like Ian. He loves to wish peace to people he actually abhors, while mixing and matching his prowess as a wordsmith. And look where it has gotten him. Actually, you’re alot like Ian – you have great potential to make a good point on some things I ordinarily would be against, but are absolutely unwilling to say the same. It’s your way – or no way. It doesn’t work.
History is in the making Scorecard: Keene 1,128 Ian 0. You can re record Judi Collin’s Send in the Clowns all you want, but it is never ever going to make the Top 10 again. Good luck with that.
Peace, love, understanding, tolerance.
They always work, Matt. Do I always practice them? Obviously, no, I am not perfect and likely never will be.
And no, I will never condone anything that is immoral. A is A, Matt, as the great warmonger Ayn Rand once said. It’s not MY way, Matt, it’s just right and wrong, caged or free, that’s it, man.
Wrong things will never be right, and I won’t be talked into condoning the caging of nonviolent people. I can see where you would find that to be stodgy and unyielding, because the nature of the government paradigm is to compromise the principles of individual liberty to promote the ‘greater good’, whatever the hell that is.
To me, the ‘greater good’ is nothing more than what is best for each individual who is a peaceful actor within society.
Thanks
History is written by the winners, Matt.
This contest has only begun
Did you just call me a winner? LOL
Holy_Canole: what also gets me annoyed is when the right-libertarians try to bill themselves as some kind of “freedom fighters” when they continually ignore and/or denounce much bigger struggles. I don’t know if you saw what I recently posted on my blog, but it seems downright hypocritical in a sense that the right-libertarians would complain all day on the internet and in other news media about how “tyrannical” the cops are in a town of less than 30,000 people and then denounce the rioters in the UK who actually responded to years and years of police brutality. If the cops through NH were really as big of tyrants as free staters claim they are (again, not defending the cops but still) then people in NH would be taking to the streets. Or the fact that some of them consider things like workers’ struggles to be “violent” and thus want nothing to do with them. Remember back in March when the public-sector union workers flooded the State House to protest cuts? Yeah, the free staters took the side of the state because they assumed that harming the unions would equal less taxes for them (it doesn’t) and hold the mentality that union workers use “force” to demand more autonomy in the workplace and higher wages. But then they demand that others feel sorry for them when they seek out trouble by doing petty things and get arrested because of it.
…a basic rule of any society is that you can’t just go around treating others around you like crap and think that they won’t react negatively in some way.
That may be true. However, if you have the power to put others in a jail cell, then even if they react negatively when you treat them like crap, it may not cause you any significant problems.
and hold the mentality that union workers use “force” to demand more autonomy in the workplace and higher wages.
Julia, the gubment workers are negotiating their wages on the backs of the people, by taxation, which you well know is theft. How can an advocate of liberty support a ‘public-sector’ labor union in any wise?
Mackler: Ian was doing this far before the state jailed him. The state being wrong doesn’t make Ian (or any Keeniac for that matter) right.
Lpviper: government workers aren’t to blame in this situation, any more than Soviet factory workers were to blame for the USSR. Taxes in NH aren’t going down.
Let me put it to you this way: I live in Windham, which is full of corporate fatcats who work for Fortune 500 companies that make their fortunes off of exploiting the third world and whatnot. Okay, so some of these fatcats use the money that they possess through the exploitation of others to hire a few Brazilians from Nashua to clean their pools and take care of their kids and all that; does that mean the Brazilian workers are to blame if they’re being paid with money that was created through extortion?
This is why no one on earth who has any kind of philosophical understanding would adhere to something like the libertarian NAP; it’s garbage. It’s not a call to “end aggression” but rather an excuse to ignore actual struggles of people who are trying to survive and instead take up arms against situations that aren’t nearly on the same level (i.e. the state making you pay property taxes. Not sure if that’s the same thing as having the wages you need to survive cut). Especially true when right-libertarians consider things like workplace expropriations, general strikes, rent strikes, and even squatting buildings owned by absentee landlords to be “aggressive” acts.
@julia,
What experience have you had with nh cops?
Trust me they can be just as bad as anywhere else.
An what experience have you had with the cops in dc Boston etc?
You may have had interactions,but …..it’s plain you are on there side.
Some want to advocate for those that are maltreated by the cops ; that doesn’t seem to be you.
I have a feeling you are not a young black male.
But then you are more powerful than most young black males so of course you speak in terms of better treatment.
I’m glad you’ve had good treatment but don’t propagate it as the rule.
Also Julia,stop speaking as if you know what all keene folks think,YOU DON’T.
Why?
Because hc disagrees ; from that you can glean that the whole town……….
Julia your talk is inaccurate and dangerous. And wrong.
I’m done with this digression into trashing people.
A note on factory to the talkative ones: there is a difference between making useless crap and rounding up slaves.
(A note to the more dimwitted ones — those caged and chained at master’s whim are called: slaves).
Julia,
Don’t even get me started on the whole ‘keeping things in perspective’ issue haha. One of the reasons I maintain that this whole movement is completely self centered and/or isolationist, is because if they were actually concerned with ensuring liberty for people, they would go to places where liberties are *actually* being encroached upon…not places which are already perhaps *the* most ‘liberty tolerant’ in the nation, if not the world. I’ve made this analogy before, but I’ll post it again: moving to Keene to complain about the oppressive ‘statist’ structure is like moving the Amsterdam to complain about the drug laws.
The Civil Rights Movement didn’t confine itself to places where segregation was already more or less a thing of the past, they went right into the heart of the problem–places like Birmingham and Jacksonville. To move to Keene NH and act as if you are living under a tyrannical regime is frankly insulting to people who *actually* have to deal with oppressive dictators, or violent police forces in their daily lives.
If you want to make a statement about a law you believe is unjust in Keene, that’s fine…but keep that statement in perspective. Don’t act like you’re being hauled away to your death when you smoke pot downtown, because there are *actually* people in this world who get killed for lesser things (and frankly who handle themselves in a much more mature manner when they come face to face with the oppressive forces.)
And I haven’t really considered the points you made about them being against the union rallies etc., but that’s definitely very interesting. I think, again, it can be chalked up mainly to the fact that they’d rather whine about silly insignificant things that most people don’t really care about in their daily lives, than actually get involved with issues which hold real consequences for real people.
Send Ian a letter by clicking here, or a postcard by clicking here.
David-Keene:
What makes you think I support the cops? I’ve said many times that I don’t. Police are armed thugs and I would never support them.
Are you a young black male? I actually know many “young black males” living in Baltimore City (my college is only a 20 minute drive away) who have told me numerous stories of *actual* cases of police brutality. No, not “OMG the police stole my cell phone!” but “The police beat me until I needed to go to the hospital”. The latter is what millions of people in the cities have suffered with; the former is something which is easily avoidable and not nearly as violent. I don’t defend police. What I’m merely trying to bring to your attention is the fact that FK is obviously painting themselves as “martyrs” when they obviously have no idea what it’s really like to be a victim of the system. It’s like claiming you are dying of cancer when all you have is a stubbed toe.
outsider: capitalism is a system of slavery, only instead of “work for the master or get beaten” it’s “work for the master or starve”. Oh sure, there are some wage slaves who end up leaving wage slavery and become self-employed, but then again, chattel slaves in colonial Brazil could buy their freedom and, once free, could become property owners, business owners, and even slave owners themselves. Notice how that did not mean chattel slavery was morally justified. So, how is wage slavery morally justified on the notion that one can “leave”? If there was a stateless territory in North America that you could move to if you saved up enough money, that would not mean that the state was legitimate.
Holy_Canole: once again, exactly. Notice how anarchists (NOT the capitalists who call themselves “anarchists” or “voluntaryists”) like myself go to cities where oppression is everywhere in order to do solidarity work. They don’t choose to move to one city in order to carry things out there, and I’m sure most comrades would completely reject the idea if someone brought it up.
FK shoves cameras in the faces of cops and smokes pot in public because they know they can get away with those things in Keene. Try doing that in Boston and see how the Boston pigs react. I understand that laws are unjust and police shouldn’t exist, but geez, going after cops in a town of less than 30,000 isn’t “heroic activism” or “martyrdom” but privilege.
And just imagine what would happen if the Keeniacs were actual anarchists who were going after landlords and corporate bosses (both of whom, I should mention, are huge proponents of statism, since the state is what protects their “right” to own their private property). How much more negative would their media coverage be? Take a look at the way the Black Bloc protesters are covered if you want an example.
Julia,
I like that you and Holy C post here….It confronts these people with the two things they have the strongest issues dealing with; Women and reason…My friend used to be a libertarian until someone said something that made him think. They said that the philosophy seems so perfect because it is directly catered to you. Being a privileged white male in the center of a philosophy designed to benefit privileged white males will always seem like the logical choice for the world..
When I get to sas them It isn’t quite the same…..Having sharp women out think undersexed over stimulated man children is entertaining…..
Yeah, we know the whole Earth is covered with this parasitic slime (slave-drivers) and was, back in history.
Keene is certainly not an exception — just witness the number of demonic rapists here in the comments. (They should feel right at home leading child rape in Africa btw, instead of here).
Girls sure write a lot. But what’s the damn point?
You should certainly appreciate a gentleman who was heroically defending a dame against the dark evil forces. Chivalry is not dead!
Name (required): I seriously think that this current trend of right-libertarian think (as is the case with the left’s shift from workers’ struggles to identity politics and postmodernism) is the natural outcome of the capitalist-statist system. It’s the kind of philosophy that’s really based on a utopian vision where every single person or family is in control of their own private mini-state, but they’re not really states because those who rule over them claim to adhere to some “non-aggression principle”. To me, it seems like it has more to do with the fact that they desire more power in their own lives (which is understandable) and over their property, and base their entire case against the state around these concepts. “Oh the state is making me do this….” I’m in full agreement that the state has no right to tell anyone to do anything, since it is inherently illegitimate, but their entire case against it is something which seems downright trivial compared to the cases against the state made by anarchists.
You know, anarchism (as it has always been defined until Rothbard stole the term and insisted it was somehow compatible with capitalism) was not theorized by people with PhDs; it was theorized by working-class people and people who gave up their privilege to fight alongside the working class. The anarchist revolutions which happened in Ukraine, Catalonia, and Chiapas (and may happen again in Greece and/or Chile) came from below, not from above. That’s why I roll my eyes when right-libertarians try to come across as “revolutionary” and “heroic” when their actions and plans of actions are anything but.
***YO!*** to: “david-keene”, DUDE! Go back and *CAREFULLY* read what “Julia” (Julia Riber Pitt) is really saying. Click on her name-link, and actually read her blog. You, “david-keene”, are mis-understanding her….Julia is really on OUR*SIDE, “david-keene”….
…and to everybody else here, ***DAMN***, this is some good stuff here…worth the reading….I’m very proud of you guys, even the ones I disagree with!…Julia, I know what you mean about the cops in a town like Keene, vs. a big city like Boston…I actually know some cops personally, and, for cops, they’re really pretty decent. “holy_canole” did make a few good points, but she is so sheltered, that she really doesn’t know what she’s talking about…the whole “FreeKeene” “thing”, really has far more support in Keene, than the media will *EVER* admit…Keene is a really unique place, but it’s got it’s share of troubles. The local paper, the “Sentinel”, will not ever, *EVER* print the *TRUTH* about what’s really going on around here. Not that it’s so bad, but that it happens at all. And, finally, especially to you, Julia, I don’t want to think I’m doing OK, because somebody else is doing worse. Yes, the cops in dictatorships, or Boston, are worse thugs than Keene cops even want to be, but that doesn’t excuse the worst of the Keene cops behaviour……This whole thing is an exercise in flexing cop*dick*muscle, and judge*dick*muscle, and state*dick*muscle, and jail guard*dick*muscle….I really don’t think that Heika’s naked boobs, and drinking beer in Central Square, are worth all this bullshit, either….BUT, it’s more fun than the usual bullshit around keene………
Jury got it right!! Definately no resisting arrest but standing in front of a police vehicle while in operation can not be tolerated! A year would be more fitting that 90 days but at least their leader is of the street for 3 months.
I’d rather my tax funded police cars not be blocked from operation by a guy wanting to protect a person from drinking in public! You rock jury!
Fuck Yeah!
No shit!
Now I’m going to go down to the police station and blow the cops! I take my cop dick in the mouth, not the ass!
Julia,
You don’t know what you are talking about.
And I don’t have the time to teach you (EVEN IF i HAD the time I really don’t have the interest)
later.
But you are wrong and you speak in a authoritative tone ; thats a bad combo
Julia,
In your worker’s paradise, who takes from each according to his ability and gives to each according to his needs? Won’t this need to be enforced? And who enforces participation in direct democracy? What happens when I refuse to participate?
Id like to know how someone posted a comment using my name? Nice trick, you guys wonder youre a laughing stock?
I guess hacking is a victimless crime too in your world! Real tough guy!
Back so soon? Did you get a tip from the pigs, you whore?
Ian is like the Daniel Berrigan of the anti-open container law movement. I really admire him for his sacrifice.
Yes I spoke with your mom and sister, they were a big help thanx.
Crap! That didn’t work out the way I thought it would. I ended up taking some cop cock in the ass after all. OK, I think I am starting to understand this liberty thing a bit better. They didn’t even use condoms!
Forgive david-keene. It’s not easy being the village idiot. But, he has happily taken up tha challenge and I think he’s doing a fine job…….
@Holy,
I don’t want to live in a community where if you’re unpopular you can be thrown in jail. The point of rights is to protect unpopular speech, actions and people from mob rule. Just because you and everyone else in town are willing to take someone’s life away doesn’t make it just, ethical, moral or right.
Go on your stupid trip and save the world form evil capitalism, return and tell everyone how that makes you a good person because you sacrificed so much for the sake of others. I still think it’s selfish of you as we all know you’re really doing it for you. There’s a bunch of simpletons in this world that would never get along without elitist, spoiled American kids showing them how society ought to be because I’m sure all of you understand what it’s like to actually have to survive a day.
Look what a good person I am for helping people. Look at me! It makes me better than everyone else. Look at me!
Narcissism. All you need now is a mirror to stand in front of.
Jasper,
The goal of my trip is not to help people, it’s to learn about how others live, and the experiences they have gone through. I’m going to gain knowledge, not to tell others how to live their lives. In fact, I believe there are many things we as Westerners could learn from others (obviously I am particularly interested in the cultures of Eastern Africa, but there are plenty of others with things to offer) for instance–how to survive *real* tyranny and oppression, like having your lips chopped off by rebel groups and paramilitaries so that you can no longer express your point of view.
If you think I am ‘spoiled’ for wanting to gain such experiences, that’s your prerogative (I agree completely that my fortunate lifestyle allows me to go on such an amazing trip, but I don’t think wanting to do so makes me spoiled) but I think perhaps you should stop and think about what exactly ‘martyrs’ like Ian are ‘risking their lives’ to support (being able to get drunk in public…) before you start lecturing me on what it means to be spoiled.
THERE’S NOTHING WRONG WITH TAKING A TRIP…AND ITS GOOD TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT OUR COUNTRY OBJECTIVELY…SRY BOUT THE CAPS
@Bill,
How come you’re in love w me?
…but this is really me….~tKoK.
I don’t want to live in a community where if you’re unpopular you can be thrown in jail. The point of rights is to protect unpopular speech, actions and people from mob rule. Just because you and everyone else in town are willing to take someone’s life away doesn’t make it just, ethical, moral or right.
You got that one right, Jasper. Canole firmly believes that the majority speaks for all of society, which means that if you’re a minority, Canole does not recognize your rights.
“Canole firmly believes that the majority speaks for all of society, which means that if you’re a minority, Canole does not recognize your rights.”
I’m flattered you feel that you have researched my beliefs enough that you can now speak for me, Mackler, unfortunately you have got your facts wrong. Please go back to letting others speak for themselves. Doesn’t that go along with your whole libertarian ideology?
“THERE’S NOTHING WRONG WITH TAKING A TRIP…AND ITS GOOD TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT OUR COUNTRY OBJECTIVELY”
Thanks, david, I agree 
People, please, let’s not argue on a day such as this. Remember, IAN’S IN JAIL! This is a day for quiet celebration, let’s no bicker and argue. Raise a glass and toast the 12 honest citizens of that noble jury.
Can anyone tell how to (if it’s even possible) to keep aperson from posting under your screenname? Did I get hacked? Or is it somethinig im not doing to protect my account? Any help here please?
Fsresistor,
I removed those comments that appeared to be coming from you.
@David,
Your goofy.
If you knew Ian you wouldn’t think it’s good he’s in jail.
Ian’s a good guy.
“I think Ian receiving such a harsh sentence reflects the fact that the general Keene community fosters at least some amount of resentment towards him/Free Keene. Say what you will about the ‘morality’ of condemning someone for mere resentment, but I am a firm believer in learning how to be a part of a community”
So if you don’t like someone, put them in jail for months for standing in front of a car, and call it “justice.”
I didn’t know it was a crime to be annoying. Shouldn’t you be locked up, then?
You’re a psychopath and a fucking bitch, Canole. Someday, your complete lack of humanity will catch up to you.
I seriously hope you don’t come back to this country. We need you like we need another cunt. Wait… oh, right. Go kill yourself.
Cry and whine. Bitch and moan. It’s good to know that someone is here to carry the torch now that Ian’s in jail and Sam is holed up in his parent’s basement in Texas. Soldier on, F Troop. Fort Courage is in fine hands.
holy_canole, mackler was just interpreting what you said(about majority rules). If you reread the arguments you yourself have been making, it boils down to majority rules the minority.
It’s pretty clear that you don’t like Ian so you can overlook the injustice that has been done, your bias is impairing your judgment.
“I seriously hope you don’t come back to this country. We need you like we need another cunt. Wait… oh, right. Go kill yourself.”
So does THIS qualify as supporting violence, moderators?
“It’s pretty clear that you don’t like Ian so you can overlook the injustice that has been done, your bias is impairing your judgment.”
No, I would support consequences for ANYONE who acted the way Ian did, regardless of who they were.
@ hc,
you do you think 3 months in a cage is the right,just treatment for what Ian did?
Do you think that justice has been one?
Do you support the “justice” meted out by judge arnold?
david-keene,
I think the punishment Ian got was harsh…I’m no proponent of jailing people for nonviolent crimes anyways. I would much rather see him out doing work to contribute to the community (road work, cleaning up sidewalks, etc.)
That being said, I do believe he deserved SOME form of punishment, and the fact that the punishment he got was so harsh I think reflects the fact that so many people in Keene find him to be detrimental to the community. I seriously believe that if he, and perhaps Free Keene in general, made more of an effort to at least get along with the majority of the population, his sentence would have been less severe. Do I think that’s fair? Yes and no. Yes, because it is an example of the golden rule–piss off your neighbors and they’ll somehow find a way to piss you off too. No, because I think there should be consistency in court proceedings, as much as possible.
So if I understand correctly, it is just to impose punishments on individuals, including incarceration and forced labor, for offending and acting contrary to the oppressive values of the majority in a community? IOW, a community may arbitrarily proscribe various behaviors, and when one challenges them, that individual may be subjected to forced detention and labor? It’s disturbing that you do not see anything wrong with that scenario.
By what right or reason do you contend these laws, prohibiting victimless self-expression, are valid? Do you even consider them valid? Does that matter in your opinion? I am truly curious to know. If your answer sounds like “the community/majority makes the rules, and he had what was coming to him”, then you will not have properly answered my questions. An answer like that would appear to be an argument ad populum fallacy.
I was under the false impression that the post had been deleted.
Everyone has a right to kill themselves, to deny them that right would be an act of violence. It might be counter-intuitive, in a world ruled by simple misconceptions.
Actually I encourage all control freaks to kill themselves, every pathetic chicken hawk who roots on the War safely from their television, and every sadistic asshole who cheers on excessive use of force for peaceful actions, which looking back on the civil rights movement, does include sitting in front of police cars and getting arrested for minor infringements, clogging up the system, etc.
But I suppose Rothbard is the new MLK? Maybe we should name a street after him. I do not speak for FK, but their tactics are nothing new. They are standard Civ-Dis, and people that just want the trains to be on time find them annoying. Fuck the trains, fuck the police, and fuck you. You SHOULD kill yourselves. It would make the world a better place, and it wouldn’t deny anyone their natural rights– it would exercise them.
“If you reread the arguments you yourself have been making, it boils down to majority rules the minority. ”
Almost every time. A more pathetic excuse for injustice is not easy to find.
tKoK-did you stop youy ‘tail’ Thurs nite last? Policy says no contact if in doubt.Instructions will follow at the main desk.FF cert. also possible. —bil
To king of keene,
Very good the ad hominim attacks, you called me everyname in the book and didnt even have to address one issue I brought up!
TO: “fsresistor”: Dude, I didn’t see even *ONE* question that you asked to have answered here, besides how can somebody “hack” your “account” here, which I explained already….ANYBODY can post here under ANY screen name, even STEAL a screen name. Only the site Admin., who can see the email addresses, knows if a poster is “for real”, or not. For example, I posted 2 posts as “fsresistor”, just to show you how easy it is. (There were 3 posts, all obviously written & posted at the same time. The site admin DID delete them, as noted, in a post, above…But, there are a couple of OTHER “spoof name” posts on here, now, too, so……Yes, it’s an ongoing problem.) So, that’s one reason why I always refer to a poster by EXACTLY how they post their name – so you’re “fsresistor”, when I’m writing something about what you have posted…like here…”fsresistor” has posted enough to have established a “persona”, so to speak, here on “FREEKEENE”…so, yes, I’d say that you do have an online “identity” here. And while I can only really speak for myself here, I’d say MOST of us here, including Ian & the site admins., really do want honest posts, that are written by who they claim to be. If you think there is some impersonating going on, bring it to the attention of the site admins., and they’re usually good about dealing with it. OK?…Now, what issues or questions did I *NOT* answer for you???…~tKoK.
il on Fri, 12th Aug 2011 9:08 pm
tKoK-did you stop youy ‘tail’ Thurs nite last? Policy says no contact if in doubt.Instructions will follow at the main desk.FF cert. also possible. —bil
……………………………….WTF???………….
……….WTF???…………………………WTF???………………………
………………………..WTF???………………………………
……………………………………………………….WTF???………………….
…..WTF???………………………………………………..~tKoK………….
(…musta got an old codebook from central dispatch…none of these ciphers match the original key, bil…….
You must use the new codebook,signified by the extra ‘Y’ in the message. —bil
Ohy. Sorry. Iy thoughty thaty wasy justy youry wayy ofy typingy….~tKoKy…..(…theKINGofKENTUCKYy???…WTFy???……
fsresistor on Sat, 13th Aug 2011 9:58 am
To king of keene,
Very good the ad hominim attacks, you called me everyname in the book and didnt even have to address one issue I brought up!
—————->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>…………………………..
UM, “fsresistor” dude, what “ad hominim” attacks are you referring to, and what issue, or question posed by you did I fail to address???…Are you confusing me with somebody else on here???…Well, c’mon, we’re waiting…we haven’t got all day…. yet.~tKoK.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Don’t drop the soap, Bernard!
So what was the result of Ian’s cross/counter Claim,,, or Don’t tell me he went in as the defendant??
He Did come in as a Plaintiff, and claimed the police interferred with his rights..
Lol wait dont tell me , he FORGOT to file a frivilous claim, againt the State for failing to state a cliam in which the court could grant relief
Or that the Court lacked jurisdiction, for there was no victim and/or no breach of contract
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