The City of Keene’s Hall of Shame
The Homeless – They’re easy to marginalize and blame for their situation. With the economy in a tailspin, the dollar facing hyperinflation, the FDIC billions in the hole, a commercial real estate bubble ready to pop, lending restrictions tightening, Obama spending money like the Weimar Republic, and over 2,000 banks expected to fail next year, unfortunately many more may end up joining them.
It is said the compassion of a society can be measured in the way the poorest and most misfortunate are treated. So after regulating, licensing, and taxing this community out of prosperity, now this unfortunate element of society; this unintended consequence; stands as a black mark the city’s bureaucrats are working to erase. Take an honest look at how government helps the poor who don’t go along with the welfare program:
(Video for Part 2 below)
I’m sure Dale Pregent, Mayor would love to hear your thoughts on this issue:
(603) 357-9805
mayor@ci.keene.nh.us
Comments
63 Comments on The City of Keene’s Hall of Shame
Really heartfelt journalism Sam. Does this mean you’re the press now?
Great job Sam. This is perfect for the people who want to “help people” through government regulation, I’m sending this around.
Guy lives in a tent, but he has money for beer and cigarettes!
My favorite video from OTN yet.
“Guy lives in a tent, but he has money for beer and cigarettes!”
Yeah, because the price of beer and cigarettes are right on par with housing costs. Way to show yourself as a jackass.
Perhaps if he cut back on the Bud lite and cigs he could get up in the AM, go get a job, and save money at the same time. No sympathy here.
Thanks guys! I agree Andrew, it’s my favorite one to date. Meg has been helping me with some of the practical aspects and I’m getting comfortable with the new gear.
Per Meg’s suggestion I bought them the 6-pack of beer, but they did have cranberry and vodka (in plastic bottles).
Their behavior certainly contribute to their situation. I hope people see that, and how the government seizes the opportunity wield it’s powers over others, usually out of alignment with their stated purpose.
Sam I think you have set a new standard for yourself and we’re all better off because of it.
Thank you!!
Nice video. On a lighter note, I like how the homeless (at least these fellows) and the elite both drink cape cods. I guess we all aren’t that different.
bob – try getting a house w/o a job. Try getting a job w/o an address.
Even assuming these guys had the means to dress up, shave and be sober for a job interview, employers aren’t about to hire middle-aged people without resume skills and experience.
Maybe if you didn’t drink, didn’t waste time online, didn’t sleep in on Weekends, then you’d be in a better position too. But how much do you think those marginal alterations will really change your situation in the face of enormous external limitations that you have absolutely no control over? The best these guys could ever hope for in this world is a small shack and a minimum wage, zero tolerance, zero advancement job.
That they would rather find enjoyment in a smoke and a drink should be a trigger for more sympathy, not a sign that they are wasting some huge potential that would be able to make them self-sufficient. There’s always a reason that they are there, and likely the govt enforced minimum wages and stifling moral-uniformity legislation are major causal factors keeping those “marginal people” out of a semi-productive life.
“…employers aren’t about to hire middle-aged people without resume skills and experience.”
He begins the first video with the comment that he was laid off last November. That means he has had a job, and therefore has experience.
If he saved up some beer and cigarette money, got a decent haircut and maybe a new shirt, he could greatly improve his chances of finding a job.
Don’t get me wrong – I think that what the government is doing is ridiculous. How a tent can be considered “safer” housing is beyond me. I just think that these guys contributed greatly to their problems, and that they can’t blame it all on the government.
why do you care how they live? if they want to be homeless, drink beer, and smoke cigs. who fucking cares. this doesn’t mean you can crush them with government tyranny.
How can they trow people off when they’re already off. Who gives a shit if they have enough for money smokes and beer. Maybe someone came through and gave it to them. It kills me to see that they have no way to keep a home. I see people talking shit about the beer and smokes, but how long do you think it would take to save the money for an appartment and keep it paid for for a few months until they can get a decent job and pay for it regularly? Sam, this was heart wrenching. I feel for them and know what it’s like to be in their position. I just happened to be lucky and had family that took me in or I might have been right out there with them.
Yaah!! kick’em when they are down!! Let them freeze to death in the winter. It’s the law!
Very good piece,this is journalism,this is the type of piece that will give you credibility in the ‘real’ world.
Years ago I worked with Todd on a couple of jobs-admittedly a lot of his troubles are self-inflicted,but that doesn’t mean they don’t exist.These guys are down on the bottom,how many of us could end up there.it doesn’t take a lot,get hurt on a job,no health insurance,no money for rent,but you may have made too much to get any govt help-where do you go??
These guys are making the best of a bad situation.Kudos to the landowner for letting them stay.Anyone that has read The Grapes of Wrath or any of the literature from those times will recognise that these people are in the same situation.
They aren’t costing us anything,they aren’t whining and saying poor me-I need help.They just want to be left alone to fend for themselves.Where would the pioneers be if they had someone telling them how to build and how to live?
As for the cigs and beer-really,who gives a shit? It doesn’t cost much,and is one of the few enjoyments and passtimes.Everyone has a habit of some sort,would we want them to have more ragged clothes too?? Or maybe only have tents and be cold? It looks like the official world would like them to suffer a bit more,after all,these guys are making their own rules!
They have their own community there,as legitimate as any city council,and actually they make more sense!
We will be seeing more of this,we had better get used to it,not just one or two ‘bums’ sleeping on a bench,but small groups of folks down on their luck and without the wherewithall to move back into the ‘real’ world.Go to California and see how many there are,these guys at least have a semblance of their own civilisation-are we as civilised or will we let them be thrown out into the cold??? —bil
Excellent work Sam and Meg.
I saw people living like that in Iraq. It’s crazy to think that in America it’s the same. There is more to come as well as the gov’t continues to destroy the economy.
Thanks to property tax there’s no affordable housing, thanks to income tax you can’t make enough money, thanks to minimum wage laws no one can hire these guys for a few bucks a day.
Where is the freedom I thought I was fighting in the desert for?
Really good small documentary. Thank you.
I don’t think it particularly matters how much sympathy you have for them, because they aren’t asking for sympathy. They simply ask to be left alone, something government will not do. However bad their situation is because of their own actions, government is making it worse.
To anyone out there that might be tempted to look down their nose at those people, remember this little bit:
Few people save their money for emergency situations. I’m not too good at it myself. That means that about half of you are likely to be in their situation should you end up minus about 3 months in a row of paychecks.
Awesome video. Everyone likes to look down on others who choose to survive in the way they can figure out. I love the comments about beer and cigarettes, especially the negative ones. Talk about a narrow view of the world. The best comment was Puke’s and also the comment over how much further the negative commenters would be without buying smokes and beer themselves. I quit smoking over a year ago and have saved $4000 by doing so. Everyone can do this. Everyone could also survive on 1 meal a day, but we choose not to. CHOICE is the key. They have a choice to live in the woods, you have the choice to harm them or leave them alone.
Choose wisely.
I’m not sure if Sam is watching this thread, but if so, I have some concerns / a suggestion that I’d like to bring to your attention… a constructive critique…
Helping them get jobs would be great. Kicking them out of their homes would not. They are not children, as you suggest in your conversation, nor is the government mommy. They are free adults who have the right to make their own choices. The government has no right to threaten them, or boot them out of their homes, even if they believe in the dubious notion that it would benefit them.
Lol @ you rehashing that argument anyway…
Being an adult, vs being a child, comes with responsibilities. One of the key responsibilities of being an adult is to be able to provide for yourself, and to not leech off of others… What happens if the food donors stop feeding them?
If they are grown adults, why are they spending money on cigarettes and beer when they cannot afford rent? Shouldn’t an adult act like one?
Your argument is about what the government should do, my discussion has moved well past and beyond that – I take it as a given that the government shouldn’t be involved in this – and that’s why I specifically said that the argument about what the government should or shouldn’t do needn’t be rehashed with respect to what I am talking about. What I am discussing is an issue of public perception with regard to the videos, and to the actions of the Keene liberty activist community, which is currently acting in an enabling capacity, rather than a helpful one. If there is nowhere else to go, it’s important that they not freeze to death – however, if your only focus with regard to these people is on the temporary shelter, and on property rights… And you aren’t taking time to regard anything else – then you are probably missing many much larger issues with regard to the long term path these people are on, the logical conclusion to where this shelter is headed, the attitudes of its occupants. Part of what I am saying is that you are not coming off as concerned for the well being of these people. It’s coming off as a protest about short-term property rights. That is detrimental to your message, if people see Keene liberty activists as single minded and unconcerned with the consequences to their actions…
If you want people to leave these homeless alone, showing them slowly killing themselves, while almost openly crying in depression, and having no plan to improve their circumstances – is not the way to do it… Showing Keene activists as continuing that cycle of (self inflicted) abuse… Is also not good. I beleive in your right to harm yourself, but I don’t think helping you to do so will get others to join me in supporting that right…
“What I am discussing is an issue of public perception with regard to the videos, and to the actions of the Keene liberty activist community . . . you are probably missing many much larger issues . . . you are not coming off as concerned for the well being of these people. . . . That is detrimental to your message, if people see Keene liberty activists as single minded and unconcerned with the consequences to their actions…”
Oh, I get it. It’s the topless / 420 / “Oh, my God, when people see this, it’s going to ruin the movement!” debate all over again. Standard reply is still “Show us how you think it should be done, and some will likely follow your example.”
Kind of… but not really. There are major differences, one is that on top of public opinion, there is the issue that you are getting involved with hurting people that you are trying to help.
You weren’t hiring crack whores to strip naked for the topless protest…
You weren’t having babies smoke weed for the 420 protest….
So the difference in this case is that you are enabling people to harm themselves. You are missing the larger point.
Sure you can take the tact that the MOST IMPORTANT thing is to IGNORE what the public might think of you…
I think MOST IMPORTANT thing is the PEOPLE involved. You are using them for your message. I thought you were better than that.
If you want to pull a quote from me pull this one -
“I beleive in your right to harm yourself, but I don’t think helping you to do so will get others to join me in supporting that right… ”
I believe in someone’s right to smoke, and drink, and not work…. I believe in someone’s right to cut their own face off if they want to…
I don’t believe in helping them to do it. I don’t think you do either Sam … The point I am trying to get across is that if seems like you ARE currently conveying that message… that not only should people have the RIGHT to harm themselves, but that if they make the decision to do so, no one should try to help them not do it, because it is their RIGHT… Do you see the difference?
I’m trying to be constructive and say that maybe you could help your message along by showing how the government is not effective in helping people that have made poor choices, and to show how private organizations are more successful.
The point being that I am suggesting that you show that SOMEONE is trying to help these people voluntarily find a plan, and how voluntary guidance towards a plan is more effective than force…
The current message seems to be only “don’t force anything on these people, it’s their right to be fuckups” and there is no focus on the helping hand.
Why not show that there are goups and organizations that are willing to use persuasion over force to help these people, and show how it is more effective?
That’s my constructive criticism, take it or leave it I guess.
They took the initiative to build their own shelter, which the city now wants to take away from them (allegedly “for their own good,” but really just to show them and sundry who’s in charge, and don’t you forget it!). Beyond that, how they live their lives is their own concern.
This article has some relevance:
Charles Johnson, “Scratching By: How Government Creates Poverty as We Know It,” http://www.thefreemanonline.org/featured/scratching-by-how-government-creates-poverty-as-we-know-it/
I’d definitely support an effort to help these people get jobs, if that’s what you’re getting at, Johnson.
“Beyond that, how they live their lives is their own concern.”
That’s one way to look at it, but as a journalist Sam, you are interacting with these people. Many people, including myself, look at that interaction journalists have with their subjects, and questions arise when the journalist could be changing the story they are in.
Do you sit idly by and film the dingo walk up and eat the baby as a commentary on irresponsible parenting, or do you scare the dingo off at the last second… still getting the story, but possibly a less sensational one. Does the journalist doing a story about hunger in Africa hand the starving child they just filmed for the story on hunger a sandwich?
In your case, do you use your powers as a journalist to HELP by asking questions that might guide private organizations into doing MORE than merely dropping food on the doorstep enabling these folks to subsist in a miserable existence of depression and perpetual homelessness at the bottom of the barrel….
or do you simply make a point about property rights and move on?
Don’t get me wrong Sam, I respect you and what you are doing… My critique in this case not meant to be a slam on you. It is simply that I think that this is such a serious issue, and I’m not seeing the caring, “Law of Attraction”, ‘help others to achieve their potential’ side of you represented here.
@Paul – That is definitely what I am getting at.
Beyond that, I am getting also at the opportunity to show how private organizations do a better job of it, through their capacity to actually CARE… and not simply use force to make it happen.
The opportunity to document that is huge.
Johnson, you need to know: I’m not the Sam who filmed the video–I’m the one who writes the songs. (Hmm-”Intensity in Tent City,” maybe? “Rat” rhymes with “bureaucrat”; now what rhymes with “poverty” . . . ?)
AH, big oops on my part… I wasn’t looking carefully enough for “SAMIAM” I just saw Sam, and assumed…
WHOOPS.
Well, I think the points are still essentially the same… and this is really a critique for OTN Sam… so… yeah.
Although, I think you might have brought up some points he might have… so… that works.
I think the analogies with the dingo or the sandwich don’t perhaps completely apply here — there’s no way Sam could have stopped them from being homeless right then and there.
I think, however, your ideas are good Johnson. I don’t think there was anything wrong with this documentary, but it would be good to follow it up with some real help for these people. What organizations are there in Keene that could help these people get back on their feet?
Sam, this is good man. Your other stuff too, but this? Top notch! Nice job
Paul, I think and feel that a piece is missing from the documentary. That missing part is really the main part of my / constructive criticism for Sam. Aside from food donations, I don’t KNOW if these people are getting real help or not. Are they getting actual motivation and counseling to move on and get back on the horse and get their lives going again? Or, are they merely getting a pittance of subsistence level donations that MIGHT keep them going, and allow to continue affording smokes and booze without starving.
These church groups MIGHT already be doing things to help motivate these guys to get jobs and move on, or they might not, there might be other private groups stepping in and offering help…. There might not be.
Without knowing that, the overall message to me seems to be only about property rights, and seems very callous. I don’t see it as ‘heartwarming’as I think maybe I’m supposed to. I’m going off how some of the editing and music was done – but I’m not sure what the intent was for audience perception. Either way, I think the journey for this piece feels very incomplete, and I hope that Sam takes it further.
I didn’t get “heartwarming” as an overall message at all. There were definitely negative implications about what the government was doing, but the impression I got was certainly not that everything would be hunky-dory if they were to stay there indefinitely.
Hi Johnson – (I was drafting this while listening to FTL before we talked!) I’ve been reading most of the comments and posts about this. I’m getting ready to head home for a few weeks, and I’m busy wrapping up a few things here.
I agree with some of the things your pointing out. However, My work captures their story not mine. That’s why I’m not really talking in the video, other than asking questions. The story is theirs – high and low spots on the table.
I agree, the people helping them are, to some extent, enabling their self-destructive behavior.
Would I eat while filming starving children in Africa? Yes, I would. I understand the power of sharing this perspective with people. This puts the story on the table, letting everyone see the problems – beer, cigs, destructive behaviors, starving children, whatever. I think that approach is superior to forcing a solution based on my narrow limited perspective (compared to the combined whole of my viewers).
Do I have a solution? Yes, I believe the ending exposes the core of Todd’s situation. Sure we could try to shoehorn him into a back to work process, and that will work for some. He doesn’t seem interested.
I think the answer is letting Todd and others like him, discover their purpose in life. Let them find their passions in life, create hope and goals, and fine meaning in his existence.
Teach him to fish so he can feed himself for a lifetime. Your a great skeptic Johnson. 
I wouldn’t blame you for eating while filming in Africa, I was more making a reference to the cameramen who eat a big sandwich but then don’t offer any to the starving people they are filming. It was less a commentary on self denial, and more of a commentary on whether or not the journalism is participatory.
Being a journalist gives you a particular tool-set to be an engine of change through how the subject is covered – even if you are trying be merely a watcher and capture stark reality, the mere act of filming it somehow changes it. As someone with a photography degree, I know all too well that the simple of act of taking a photograph of a peculiar piece of trash on the sidewalk can transform that refuse into art that people suddenly appreciate. Videography isn’t so different. In fact, I believe it’s impossible for a journalist NOT to make a difference, even if they are trying to be neutral.
(Unless of course, I guess if maybe a video was so bad no one paid attention, but you definitely don’t have THAT problem)
Anyway, I don’t want to see any of those folks shoehorned, or abused by the state and kicked out of their home – I do however, hope that the Keene liberty community, having seen the plight of these people, can take this a step beyond simple food donations. I hope that the charities and churches can somehow help find a way to rekindle and ignite the passion in these guys, and get them into a position where they are providing for themselves. Liberty activists should (I assume)understand the depressing feeling that comes with not providing for oneself, EVEN if it isn’t the state that is being leeched off of. Even if they aren’t participating in outright theft, as state support would be, they are still living off of the backs of others, and a great opportunity exists to really do something meaningful here beyond a simple victory over ‘the state’. I hope that someone up there is taking steps to give these guys some real support and help them to find a way to eventually get out of those circumstances.
Simply saying that “they are not harming anyone” is not a very good argument when it makes you look like someone who doesn’t give a crap about anyone but yourself. (not that I would ever accuse you of that Sam, but I definitely get that vibe from some people here that I don’t think really believe that way)
“They are not harming anyone” is a great argument against FORCING someone to do something, but it is not a great argument against getting someone the help they need, in a private and voluntary fashion… and these guys need more, and better quality help. I believe someone up there must exist that has the wherewithal to help them get it.
Oh, and as far as the skeptic thing… I just haven’t ever seen any magic or special powers personally… so it makes it really easy to be skeptical. I have seen many many people lie (IE: Most people) about such things, and reading about how such flimflam artists make their money through those lies, and what tricks they use makes it really obvious where the motivations are, and how they work. Almost all flimflam hoaxsters use very similar tricks to accomplish their lies, so for me, disbelieving in magic that I’ve seen repeatedly disproven, is as easy as disbelieving that using force and bureaucracy to achieve something noble, since I’ve seen that repeatedly disproven as well.
This is the first time I’ve seen the homeless used in the service of the libertarian agenda. I thought that stupidity was a liberal specialty.
Can we agree that even in a libertarian, small gov’t world, society will not be perfect and there will still be unhappiness, failure, crime, addiction, homelessness, and poverty? The question is, which type of government arrangement minimizes social pathology, not eliminates it completely–that’s impossible.
Can we agree that even in a libertarian, small gov’t world, society will not be perfect. . .?
I can agree with that.
The question is, which type of government arrangement minimizes social pathology, not eliminates it completely–that’s impossible.
I’m glad your perspective on possible ways to minimize this kind of misfortune are not limited by government’s problem solving abilities.
Few points:
(a) These guys are not homeless. They have a home. It’s that very home that the government wants to take away because it doesn’t conform to the city’s regulations.
(b) Johnson, what if they are able to reach a state of self-sustaining (or closer to it) through their garden and Timothy Robertson continues to allow them to stay there?
I think it is a great idea to offer them assistance if they want it, but I do not get the impression Todd’s terribly depressed and unhappy there. In fact, I got the impression he’s hoping his garden does well so he can provide more for himself and can put off looking for a 9-5. How about instead of bringing him counseling and trying to convince him he’s unhappy in that lifestyle, you brought him bags of seeds and fertilizer (this is assuming Tim is ok with it)? How about instead of trying to get him to conform, you actually listen to him? Or if Tim would like for them to move on, maybe help Todd and the others work out a deal with someone with a nearby plot of land?
Why do you assume they want to get jobs and re-join the working world? Isn’t that imposing your standards on them?Maybe some would like to progress into that world,and others have built their own comfort zone,not everyone fits into todays society.It would be nice to think that if we got them a clean place to live,good food,addiction help,and jobs,they would then be happy,productive members of society.Some would,others would be back in the woods.
There are many causes of homelessness,a lot is due to addiction and /or mental health problems.No matter what you do,there is a certain percentage of the population that does not fit in.Helping them in the short term will work for a while,long term help may not.
While not infering that any of these men in the tents are criminal,the situation is much like a certain sector of prison population.There are some that cannot function in the outside world,and commit a crime to get back to their ‘comfort zone’.They prefer it to the outside world.Why do we want everyone to conform?I believe in offering all the help needed for someone that wants it,mental care for those in need of it,and a way out of that life for those that want out.Shelters,places to clean up,job training and education.For the rest,leave them alone if they want to be left alone. —bil
I agree that the state should leave them alone. As far as your belief in offering help, no one is currently offering that help. Help consists of basic food and sustinence as of now (and I’ve found this out even though I live ~ 150 miles from Keene)
Sometime leaving someone alone is good, sometimes it’s not…
If you have a family member become hopelessly addicted to say, heroine to the point the they no longer function for any other reason than to get that drug, are you going to leave that person alone until they die on the floor of a drug den?
Sometimes it’s good to actually give a shit about a fellow human being.
Regardless of that – the help isn’t even there right now, but it should be… It’s pretty obvious that these guys are not content with their lives… You can see the one man almost burst into tears in Sams video! Sure, they want to be left alone by the state – but they obviously want have some meaning in their lives… The one man worked over 30 years in construction… That is someone who understands the value of creating something of worth through hard work. I don’t believe that someone like that can be content living off that backs of and charity of other people.
You are also imposing values by suggesting that no one should try to help these guys find their sense of self worth again. Especially if you are suggesting that no private organizations get involved.
I am suggesting none of the above.As posted way up in the thread,I have worked on the same jobs as Todd.He himself admits his aflictions are self-induced.
I am also not saying there shouldn’t be any help for them,public,private,or personal.I also believe that if someone has reached a point due to addictions or mental issues that they cannot make rational issues,there should be some sort of remedy availlable.
Since the discovery of horrendous conditions [back in the 60s,I believe the main case was a place called Creedmore] the government has not been allowed to just scoop up and keep people with these problems.it takes a long involved process,and is not usually successful.Usually the method is to wait until it becomes a criminal matter,and then the person is thrown into the general prison population,very seldom getting the proper treatment.
I am not suggesting no-one should offer to help get their self-worth back,either public or private.I am stating that there is a percentage that are not willing or able to accept this help.If they are content to live in the woods,leave them alone.I do not suggest not helping with food or other things to make life more comfortable or even more bearable.I am glad to see that the city pointed out what they should have for basic safety and sanitation,and help has been provided along those lines.
My own work has been greatly diminished with the current economy-I would like to be able to offer a job.I am not in that position.There are several homeless people over in Brattleboro in a similar situation.I have bought them sleeping bags,food,and fuel.I have given them rides,there was one guy that went out looking for work,walking.I would stop and give him a ride into town.But I would certainly not stop at his ten t and tell him he had to look for work.The fact that he went out every day showed he still had a sense of worth,also the fact he wasn’t hitch-hiking,he was willing to walk if needed.
My point is-if someone truly doesn’t want to be bothered,then leave them alone.Give them the options,but it is a choice they have to make to change their life. —bil
The scary part is that the real cold has not even started…
I love the suggestion of showing an alternative to the big government solution. So far as these people finding purpose… My experience is that finding meaning and purpose is pretty hard to do when you cannot keep warm , and your stomach is gnawing your backbone.
It is commendable that people are leaving food. But leaving food is only a first step. It takes care of the today needs, but it does not set these people on the road to feeding others, or even themselves. It just makes the outcome (starvation or self-reliance) another day further in the future. All this said, I am not sure what the next thing to help would be.
How great, refreshing & humble are these folks!
They labored and didn’t rob, they built their home and family using little but creativity, they don’t throw hapless souls out into the cold, and it ain’t any of their business or judgment what goes on outside the gate.
None of which can be said about the scum & tax-feeding leeches inhabiting the Keene GOVMNT. Or the pompous cretin slaves often supporting it.
It’s obvious from the dialogue bursting from this thread that you accomplished what you intended Sam. One thing that caught my attention was the man’s comment that all of the local shelters were exhausted.
It seems apparent to me, that the type of help Johnson, Bil, Sam, and other commenters talk about does exist. In reality it is possible for society to provide a private shelter (Paul) that doesn’t have curfews (Sam), allows for freedom of choices (Puke), mediates and educates (Johnson), and increases self fulfillment.
Now take that reality and realize the hundreds of regulations, taxes, licenses, permits, and laws that prevented this from becoming a reality. We can only dream what humanitarian progress has been stifled at the expense of the state.
There’s a few important facts that you all are missing. No, I haven’t yet read every word in these posts, but I know you new-comers don’t get it. Who owns the land these “homeless” people are squatting on? Some is owned by PSNH, for their power lines & poles. Some is owned by Tim Robertson & his sister. The exact property line boundaries are unclear. Tim Robertson has wanted to develop that land for years. It’s not really suitable for development, floodplain & wetland considerations aside…So Tim’s support of these guys keeps the issue in the news. It lets him sit back & enjoy the controversy. Typical of the bleeding-heart-liberal, Socialist/Fascist Robertson. He doesn’t really care about these guys. Look at the first news reports in the Sentinel: They claimed not to know who owned the land. HAH! Now, the landowner has been identified. Last night, Mon., Dec 21, there was a candlelight rally for the “homeless”, on Central Square. Who was there? Tim Robertson? Nope. Mayor Pregent? Nope. The City Council? Nope. Well, there was a nice woman from the “Governors Committee on Teen Homelessness”, or some such bullshit. The “outreach workers” from MFS & SWCS(MFS= Money, Federal, Steal/Make Folks Suffer/MotherFuckingShitheads/etc…, SWCS=Southwestern Community Services) These “outreach workers” want job security, which means a steady supply of homeless people. If I, for example, could solve the “homeless problem”, what would these people do for work? Get a real job?…Who organized the rally? *Working Families Win”, and Ms. Jaime Contois, whose office is in the *ROBERTSON BUILDING* on Eagle Court. *FOLLOW THE MONEY*, PEOPLE! Here’s how it works: Get people all riled up about an issue, in this case, homelessness. Have the local “non-profits” come forward with wringing hands, saying we need more money to “help” these people. The TAX$$$ FLOWS! Social workers jobs are preserved, and we still have homeless people. The rich get richer, the poor get poorer. As to these guys just “wanting to be left alone”, that’s a crock of shit, too. They are loving the publicity & attention. And, after I spoke out at last night’s rally, one of the guys got in my face, threatened me, and tried(unsuccessfully)to start a fight with me. So much for “peaceful” huh? You people really need to think beyond the immediate message. There’s much more going on here than meets the eye. Welcome to JUMANJIVILLE…***I support the imminent military coup.I *AM* the imminent military coup. You can’t lock up & kill all of us. And remember, you keep adding to my numbers, as you shoot my people down.
The city knew they were out there. Heck they had medical emergency, a tent fire with someone burnt, and the cops have dealt with illegal issues, some in the news some not. They kept it hush hush and left them alone, but the Sentinel blew this one for the guys who want to be left alone. They went in and did a three day, “front page” story, which got picked up by others and before you know it the officials now have to deal with the issue due to liability.
Wanna thank someone, thank the sentinel for trying to sell more papers… sad
Is this the regular military coup,or a differant military altogether? While I am in favor of the overthrow of the present regime[no,not the Obama presidency,the entire system]I was not aware of any eminent military coup,and have been preparing to go it alone.
As for the homeless/welfare system just being a job bank for government stooges,yes,it certainly is.It has become a profitable industry for some. —bil
to those who are focasing on the beer and cigs stfu they have that freedom whats wrong with that and their only homeless because the gov says they are we may soon all be between the gov bankruping everybody and the soon to be fake food shortage and all the land their about to steal you could be next they don’t need gov help what they need is to learn homesteading skills and be able to build a proper home like a log cabin but we all know the gov wont allow that that would be to good for them they should allow them to raise chicken an rabbits maybe get some goats grow a proper garden build a root cellar and learn safe foraging technics we all should know how to survive well off the land maybe the community can come together and start to permaculture the land for everyone to use i know the gov wont allow this but how will they stop people from making seedballs and just start tossing them around NH is the free state right? don’t ask do and to all the activist out there how about instead of getting arrested run for office and change the laws just a thought yeah you might have to play by their rules for a little wile but if you can get the right positions filled you can change the rules we as a country need to stop thinking of only ourselves and start looking out for each other or we are all doomed
ps srry about no punc was a little peved by sum of the freedom haters. but feel better now:) here are some extras …………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………
to all the activist out there how about instead of getting arrested run for office and change the laws
Nick Ryder ran for City Council. He did not win. Ian attempted to run for Mayor. People that come to this website try different approaches to gain liberty. So far, it would appear civil disobedience has had the biggest effect. How many people were smoking marijuana during the 420 events? Although there were arrests made, I’d say the overall time investment by Rich Paul in courts/jail will be less than Nick spent trying to get elected. And Rich actually tasted a little bit of liberty, as did many of the others at the events.
Another example: A large group went to a rally at the statehouse last winter in support of the sovereignty bill. When it didn’t pass, a few of the supporters boo’d the legislators. Some of the crowd were open carrying guns. The reward for this attempt to work within the system is now guns are not allowed at the state house. That attempt to work within the system has actually restricted liberty.
Now, I’m not going to say, “Don’t try to work within the system.” I think everyone should try to do whatever they think is best as the motivation and energy will come easier if you’re following what you believe in. And who knows, maybe it is possible to get more people elected to the state house and really fight those attempting to curb the liberties of the people of New Hampshire.
“Nick Ryder ran for City Council. He did not win.”"I’d say the overall time investment by Rich Paul in courts/jail will be less than Nick spent trying to get elected.
ty for responding. this is my point all these people show up in support of smoking pot which is good because #1 it’s ridiculous to ban nature
#2 it’s only being used to enslave us
and the list can go on ,but why when you have a chance to do it right no one has the time.if we want change we are going to have to work hard at it. the powers that be are deadly serius about enslaving us,and have billions of dollor’s to do it.now you guy’s in keen have an exellent oppertunity to make a change and it’s not just the mayor’s office that needs to be ran for. how about running for sheriff that is the most powerfull possision which require’s a clean record i’m sure.and buy just hanging out smokin pot in public is not going to win the respect of the other freedom loving citezens in town. yes you should have the right to smoke weed,but there are those that dont want the recless behavior that comes with it.this just give the enslaver’s more power.that energey would be more effective getting more people with clean records elected. that is the only way change is gonna happen. these people in power now don’t care how many people get put in jail it’s all money to them. prisons get paid on how many beds are filled. and i don’t mean to offend but we all need to pull are heads out of our a**’s and understand the enemy.we are faceing the most greedy corrupt people on the planet who have unlimited resource’s. it cant be done buy sitting in a park smokin weed they need to be removed and laws changed term limits given and corperate influance removed ond outlawed.
Yes, we agree on what outcome we want. The question is, what is the easiest way to get it? I honestly do not know.
I do know it appears to be extremely difficult to get elected to any office in Keene running on a liberty campaign. It is a left-leaning city. The representatives from this district tend to be Democrats who look to the government for solutions. Nick running for city council isn’t the first to try. I hope he’ll try again and get more success as he gets gains name recognition. My point is: there are people trying to get elected to offices in Keene right now.
If I could snap my fingers and get folks elected to city positions, I would. If I could snap my fingers a second time and have those elected remove draconian measures, I would. The problem is, it’s not that easy to get elected nor to actually do anything once you’re in office. I personally don’t think it is impossible, but I can understand why people might think so. It takes more than a clean record. Much, much more. At a minimum, I would say it takes years of building name recognition within the town and getting people to know who you are. Unless you are wealthy (or a fabulous fundraiser) and can afford to speed up that process.
People do civil disobedience for a lot of different reasons. Some do it in hopes of recruiting more liberty activists. Some do it to draw public attention to an issue and/or the gun in the room. From those I’ve talked to, I’d say most do it for reasons of integrity as they simply view much of the taxation and restrictions as immoral.
If you are looking to be surrounded by those trying to work within the system, I’d recommend checking out the Concord/Manchester area. Of course anyone is welcome in Keene, just make sure you know what to expect.
Some people like yourself say those at the 420 events should use that energy to try and change the system without breaking the law. You know how many activists it took to do the 420 events? Two. It started with just two people but garnered a lot of public support. How much good could two people have done in the same amount of time trying to work within the system?
buy just hanging out smokin pot in public is not going to win the respect of the other freedom loving citezens in town
I completely disagree. It may not win the support of many older voters or government workers, but it definitely wins the support of young, freedom-loving individuals. Most of the people involved knew nothing of FreeKeene.com but they do love freedom.
Oh, and the sheriff position is not elected. He’s selected by a city official.
–”Some people like yourself say those at the 420 events should use that energy to try and change the system without breaking the law.”–
srry if i gave the impression i was against the 420 event ,i’m not.my point is why cant that event be use to better organize to get one of your own elected.maybe do like the open carry clean up,except have it open smoke clean up or somethin positive like that it might at least make the cops feel bad about arresting people wile the rest of the community see toker’s in a positive manor. i don’t claim to know the answer.just really tryin to give something to think about.
–”Oh, and the sheriff position is not elected. He’s selected by a city official.”–
that’s weird because most county’s in u.s. this is an elected position if not run for the seat that hire’s the sheriff i know it’s not easy if it where we would be a free country:)
–”If you are looking to be surrounded by those trying to work within the system, I’d recommend checking out the Concord/Manchester area. Of course anyone is welcome in Keene, just make sure you know what to expect. ”–
i really don’t know how i’m supposed to take this comment. if i come off offensive in anyway i apologize i just thought free people where free thinker’s
anyway keep up the good work
drew
maybe do like the open carry clean up,except have it open smoke clean up or somethin positive like that it might at least make the cops feel bad about arresting people wile the rest of the community see toker’s in a positive manor
Ah, yes, I misunderstood. My apologies. I do like this idea. Maybe someone (or you!) can start this initiative.
i really don’t know how i’m supposed to take this comment. if i come off offensive in anyway i apologize i just thought free people where free thinker’s
I misunderstood where you were coming from. Sorry.
Sorry, PAULO, in NH, County Sheriff is an elected position…Still, considering that only about 10% of voters actually bother to vote…
“Sorry, PAULO, in NH, County Sheriff is an elected position…Still, considering that only about 10% of voters actually bother to vote…”
lol then it should be easier to get some one elected. who wants to be sheriff
[blockquote]Sorry, PAULO, in NH, County Sheriff is an elected position[/blockquote]My mistake, was confusing it with Chief of Police: http://forum.freekeene.com/index.php?topic=2151.0
[blockquote]lol then it should be easier to get some one elected. who wants to be sheriff [/blockquote]
Sounds like job for someone like yourself!
Trying this again.
Sorry, PAULO, in NH, County Sheriff is an elected position
My mistake, was confusing it with Chief of Police: http://forum.freekeene.com/index.php?topic=2151.0
lol then it should be easier to get some one elected. who wants to be sheriff
Sounds like job for someone like yourself!
lol maybe when i move there and start meeting people i will. i think you might have had to be a resident for at least a year though. some free stater must be interested. it’s the most powerful position. get that and the chief has to obey.:) even the mayor cant tell you what to do. the constitution is your only law you have to obey.
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