420 Activists Kick Off Topless Tuesdays

Rich Paul called Porc 411 yesterday to announce something different would be seen at the 420 – turns out it was what has been dubbed, Topless Tuesdays. Qik video from the scene:

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  1. I'm not a fan, I think this is very bad PR … but I suppose people are going to do what they're going to do regardless of what I think about it.

    The motivation of those who want to outlaw pot is to control the lives of others — to protect people from themselves. Their motivation is not that they do not want to see pot smoked, but that they don't want pot to be smoked. This is evidenced by the fact that they've outlawed it everywhere, including not only smoking the plant, but growing it or selling it.

    The motivation of those who object to public female toplessness, by contrast, is that they themselves don't want to see it — it's a much more defensive position, and more defensible.

    Really, it boils down to a tragedy of the commons situation (not that most people will realize this). People are forced to pay for the property, who want to go topless on the property, and who don't want to have toplessness on the property, and so conflict is inevitable.

    It's a much trickier point than just "leave people alone who aren't harming you", because the people who will react strongly to this will feel that they have been harmed. In a way, they have. They can't use property they paid for without what they see as intolerable visuals.

    What's more, it's legal. So, the purpose of this event clearly is not reform of government, or opposition to aggressive violence, it is reform of social mores. As I've pointed out before, it's really libertine activism, not libertarian activism.

    That said, it didn't cause the end of the world the first time around, so I doubt it will this time …

    Good civil disobedience should demonstrate clearly the immorality of a bad law. In fact, ideal civil disobedience is just the opposite of this — something most people do not find objectionable, which is nonetheless illegal.

  2. Reforming public opinion is one of the tasks that needs to be achieved. Today people are intolerant and gender-bigots. Gender-equality is just as important as getting rid of bigotry such as racism. Because it is ideas that will unravel in forms of oppression and authoritarianism unless rid of.

  3. Life is full of risk. If you cross the street, you might get hit by a bus, you might get mugged, or you might see breasts.

    I don't like to see dogs crapping in public places, so I avoid places where that might happen.

  4. I have to agree with Paul on this one. Boobs are not the same as a man's chest. There is a difference. I think this is very bad PR on the part of those taking part in it.

  5. Paul, I think your statical math is just incorrect. I think this is extremely effective for activating and converting personal freedom lefties… i.e. the world I come from. I don't know your actual beliefs on guns, but EVERYTHING you just said, could be applied to open carry gun rights. Open carry turns off my hippie friends big time, they don't want to see it… So should we stop that too?

    Plus come on… can't you see if we don't stand for freedom of women, we can't hope to attract women?

    I know I'm being too harsh here, and I know I won't convince you… But if you could put yourself into the shoes of a feminist, what does it sound like if a group is screaming freedom freedom freedom, but won't stick their neck out for their freedoms?

  6. Bad PR (not to mention just plain trashy) would be the idiot girl that ran in front of my car to join these people and announced loud enough for me to hear very clearly in traffic that she just flashed a school bus! She was running from the direction of the MIDDLE SCHOOL!

  7. @FormingDeath

    You going to go have public sex to fight for your freedom to have sex in public? What about just baring your dick? I bet that goes over really well.

    A woman's anatomy is not the same as a man's. To stand for a woman's right to bare her boobs is no different than standing for a man's right to bare his dick. To not understand the fact that women are built differently than men is immature, IMO.

  8. @Brodie

    I only made an argument of pure effectiveness. I don't believe that would be effective, public sex. If you can disprove or contradict anything I've said about the effectiveness of topless women attracting the support of LEFTIES, i.e. 50% of the country, or feminists, who hold these rallies often… I'd love listen to that evidence.

  9. I'm sorry, I am not sure where the statistic comes from that 50% of the people in this country support women going topless in public.

  10. You're right, I don't know how many people it is. But it is EVERY SINGLE human that I know personally. I have a sense I come from a different background here. I was and I think a lot of liberals are, one real economic lesson away from liberty.

    Being like Europe is a integral part to the zeitgeist of the American left. Topless beaches and topless women are a clear example of Europe having more freedom than us. I hear this often on Huffington Post, old Air America, Young Turks, Bil Maher, etc. I think those type of people would be supportive of these rallies.

  11. I think to any non-libertarian who doesn't like to see this sort of thing, the main point should always be stressed… if you don't like seeing this, then you should work to privatize the park. Then the private owner can make their own rules. But if it's public, anything goes.

  12. Dear freestaters/freekeeners,

    Please find a new town to sleaze up with this groundbreaking "activism".

    NO ONE in Keene has ANY respect for YOU!


    You really should relocate and start fresh…you dont have a chance in Keene!

  13. Shucks – guess that's it, then. No one likes liberty activists because a small portion of them did something that someone disagreed with!

  14. Sorry, Ian.

    Back to Florida you go!

  15. I was also born and raised in Keene,

    And I say the more liberty activists the better 🙂

    It's time to stop using aggressive violence to control other people's finances. It's time to respect our neighbors choices, and stop threatening them in a bid to run their lives.

    I'm tired of the big government warmongering right, trying to run the world and control the personal choices of free people, and I'm tired of the big government nanny state left, mugging their neighbors to pay for wasteful and damaging so called social programs, and regulating every aspect of our lives. I'm tired of both parties mugging us, and sending our money to billionaire bankers and other corporatists, I'm tired of the war on drugs turning our streets into war zones, and spending us into bankruptcy.

    I want to see more peace, nonaggression, and liberty.

    Oh, and I agree with Seth. If this were private property, it wouldn't be an issue.

  16. Actually,Paul,it would.If the private property was in view from public property,it is still a no-no.Maybe the air space over private property is public.If she was walking around in her front yard topless,there is a 'rule' against that also.:{ —bil

  17. I think it's legal, bil, even right on public property.

    It's against social mores, however.

    I'm just saying, if the park were privately owned, and the owner wished to prohibit toplessness, nobody would have a problem with it. If the owner wanted to permit toplessness, nobody would have a problem with that either, (as long, as you say, the activity was not clearly visible from a major thoroughfare or something).

    There's no reason people with different social mores cannot coexist. It's the "public" property aspect that creates the conflict, because one group is going to be forced to fund the property while not having their social mores respected on it.

    In a more free society, we could have topless parks, and non-topless parks, based on the desires of the owner. People could choose to frequent, and fund, the parks that best match what they're looking for.

    Issues of adjacent property conflicts can be resolved using arbitration if necessary … or at last resort, good fences ;).

  18. You are right,in fact,I just took a visitor from South Africa to one such private topless 'park' near LAX.No-one complained,and it was privately funded.If it had been in view of the public,not so good.It is imposing your social mores on others that is where the problem exists,from both sides of the question.And good fences make good neighbors. —bil

  19. Is no one else bothered by the fact that some of the people doing this FLASHED BOOBS at a bus of MIDDLE SCHOOL KIDS!?!?!?!?

  20. @Amazed. The students on the bus in question appeared to contain 2-5 high school students. I think the flashing was in poor taste, as I believe the objective here is to demonstrate that a topless female shouldn't be sexualized, and flashing leans in a more sexual direction then simple toplessness. It calls attention to the fact that you are not wearing a top, rather than just not wearing one and going about your business.

  21. Amazed,

    I am sure that it never occurred to you that it is our particular duh-merican culture that has a sad tradition of some repressed and weird views regarding the naked body we were born with, ever being shown in public.

    You may choose to live free by doing one simple thing regarding such a fact…get over it. Of course you may happen to be one of those pesky kops that has nothing better to do than read this forum on the taxpayer's dime instead of some busybody sycophant for the state.

    If that is the case, then please understand that there is hardly a dime's worth of difference between someone who constantly polishes his badge in public and a chronic masturbator. Have a nice day.

  22. I do think flashing a school bus, if it really occurred, is in very poor taste.

    I'd say flashing in general is in poor taste, because you're attempting to intentionally violate the social mores of others. If a person is going to go topless, they should do so in a way that is least likely to cause affront to others (Ideally on their own property, but again tragedy of the commons applies, since they're being forced to fund the park). Certainly they should not intentionally go out of their way to cause offense.

  23. Hi "Born and raised in Keene, NH",

    If it were true that NO ONE in Keene has ANY respect for us, then we would be quickly rounded up and put into cages. However because some people agree with us, it hasn't happened yet.

    You really ought to read what some have posted throughly, it would help you in solving any problems you currently have in your own life.

    For example, you think that this activism is 'trashy', the solution to stopping this would be the privatization of all lands currently owned by the 'People of Keene'. Once privatization has been reached then setting the rules of this private property could be quickly set.

    Another alternative would be to setup your own swath of land, either by yourself or with your own like-minded friends, so that you never have to leave your swath of land and thereby will never have to see a unclothed body ever again.

  24. ^^^^^^^^^^

    I feel much pity for you, I truly do.

  25. Are topless Tuesdays going to continue.

  26. Not if it doesn't warm up soon!Then I would also feel pity-its cold with no shirt,male or female! —bil

  27. <blockquote cite="">Is no one else bothered by the fact that some of the people doing this FLASHED BOOBS at a bus of MIDDLE SCHOOL KIDS!?!?!?!?

    Worse, there was a young HUSSY there flashing her bosoms at her own NEW-BORN BABY! And letting him TOUCH THEM!! And put his MOUTH on them!!!

    I'm just glad there are people like you and me who have the good sense to oppose all the DISGUSTING FILTH that God had the bad taste to include in His creation!

  28. Have you not heard of breastfeeding? Dear lord…

  29. Please somebody tell me why boobs are viewed as a sexual object? They’re no more sexual than feet.

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