Liberty Activists Hold Candlelight Vigil in Front of Rivera’s & Burke’s Homes
About two dozen liberty activists’ peaceful candlelight vigil for Kurt Hoffman in front of Eli Rivera’s home (KPD’s prosecutor) resulted in a confrontation by KPD officers on duty, followed by Eli himself. Here’s some grainy blackberry footage:
Activists later brought the vigil to Edward Burke’s home (the robed man) – four cops responded there and were offered free pizza. The officers refused, and went away. Look for more video soon from the Obscured Truth Network.
Comments
117 Comments on Liberty Activists Hold Candlelight Vigil in Front of Rivera’s & Burke’s Homes
“The police… feel our presence is intimidating…” — I’ve never heard that one before! Priceless!
Is this what it feels like when the government is fearing the people?
I think that many members of the KPD deserve a lot of credit for engaging in reasoned discussion, as I see in this video. Obviously I would have fundamental disagreements with any police department in the country as they are today. The KPD, though, based on what I have seen, is a pretty darn good one compared to others.
I get the impression that many of these people genuinely can think as individuals, and are capable of exercising discretion, and obeying their consciences — they are not doomed to be automata following orders.
Basically, I want to recognize that the fundamental issues we are dealing with are universal, and the problem is not with KPD officers specifically, as compared to any other department.
Of course it is not anywhere close to ideal, but I cannot imagine that any other department would do a better job addressing these situations.
We should not lose sight of the underlying immorality, nor does it excuse that immorality, but I think it is worth recognizing and appreciating.
I don’t think these crowd sessions with the police are productive. Lots of people shouting questions and answers lets them pick and choose what they actually respond to. It’s just a big cluster fuck. I don’t think it’s that useful for reaching video viewers either. Ultimately, all you get out of them are the usual tired talking points.
You’re talking to people very entrenched in their positions, with a bias toward protecting bad laws that target innocent people. They’re jobs depend on those millions of words of laws on the books that most people barely have an inkling of. They’re not about to say “Oh, you’re right. I’ll stop enforcing that bad law.”
It underscores the need for law enforcement types to understand the nature of law and how it has been perverted into the violator of rights that it is today. Unless this point is being made clear, they will not get it. As I posted here last night, Fredric Bastiat’s ‘The Law’ is a great way to show this to people. The ideas within are explained very clearly and logically. Maybe this won’t convert them either but it’s another nail in the coffin of state legitimacy and there’s no reason not to drive it home.
You guys are fucking nuts. I’m just trying to think of all the different legal weapons the judicial system has to destroy anyone who messes with court officials outside of the official process. The police were hinting at some bringing some of that pain in the vid, and you can bet they’ll have it figured out next time: Obstruction of justice is the obvious catch all, but they could also try witness intimidation or something like that. I’m not saying I’m not sympathetic, I’m just saying, why do you think protesting against politicians is permitted? Because the judicial system says so. Protesting judges and lawyers? Not so much.
If the law permits any group of men to commit an act that would be illegal if one man did it, then the law is wrong and those enforcing it are tyrants. Do you suggest that liberty minded people or any other people for that matter should sit idly by and allow this, because somehow ‘court officials’ are sacred and not to be messed with?
Look beyond fear and find the truth, Spam Man
Instead of posting up in front of their homes, a better call would have been to flood there mailboxes with letters telling how you feel. How hurting our peaceful friends and neighbors isn’t appreciated. I believe this particular candlelight thing was a fail.
I’ve sent lots of letters over the years, and not one of them has ever done anything to change the problem with the law. What should I put in my letters to make them work, and how would this draw attention to my cause more effectively than, say, a candlelight vigil in front of the home of a tyrannical cop or judge?
wow that video was intense. Rivera was so pissed. And the other police there were like “WTF, they can come to our houses now?”
The cops might try to claim harassment, but I doubt they will get very far. It’s not illegal to knock on someone’s door (as long as you leave if they ask you to).
Sam sounded very upset at one point. I’d like to hear more on that. Sam didn’t sound this upset while he was in jail, why so upset now?
An appearance of Keene having a good police department is not likely to be a coincidence but more likely due to the hard work of those who spent many hours confronting them in a constructive and instructive manner. This was my first encounter with Rivera, but he has a serious anger problem and has no business being any part of the criminal justice system – other than to bring in to an anger management class to demonstrate how not to behave! Cruel actions produce cruelness in the people, and he may have been treated very cruelly in the past, and keeps trying to take it out on someone, anyone, at the least excuse, but the criminal justice system has no room for anyone of that nature. Note, of course, that criminal is being used as an adjective and not a noun.
Sam was upset not because he had been physically injured by Rivera, but because Rivera was continuing that pattern of physically injuring others repeatedly. One time you reprimand them. Twice you make them go look for another line of work more suitable for them.
I gather that many here genuinely would like to engage the police in a meaningful dialog about modifying the way certain laws are enforced. However I do think that messing with them and their families at their homes is the wrong way to do it. Now if you are just looking to provoke a confrontation or cause them to be even more deeply entrenched in their ways then keep it up. If you want to have your vigils at the court, the police station, Central Square, or other public places then that is fine. But if you start messing with them at home you will destroy any progress you may have made with the officers. Not to mention any hope of future progress in that area.
I disagree. These men will now have their families asking them, ‘Why are those people out on the street with candles in front of our house?’
What are they gonna say? ‘Because they’re violent law-breaking animals?’ Even the most brainwashed of the ignorant won’t buy that.
The tyrannical actions of these men are coming home to roost, literally. That is what they have earned for themselves by their actions, and by their abuse and imprisonment of peaceful people.
Further violence by them in response to people with candles will be seen for what it is, the heavy hand of tyranny on those the tyrants consider as lesser than they.
By what logic do you assert that the vigils were destructive?
This is great activism. Might be even better if you don’t even talk to the cops, just hang out in front of the house with candles and ignore the police…
You have definitely got their attention. I take back the letter comment. I guess my opposition isn’t the candlelight vigil or even where it was done. It would be wasting my breath talking to those rock-head bureaucrats. oh John just said the same thing.
@R
Unfortunately after people get home from their jobs the only place to protest the actions of these thugs is when they are at their homes. People have a right to peacefully assemble and ask their public officials to stop hurting people.
They should get a job in the private sector if they don’t like being public officials.
I am sure if the government was accessible after people got home from work or on the weekends, they would address their public officials and hold vigils at government offices.
For the sake of discussion put the shoe on the other foot if you can. How would you feel if people were demonstrating outside your house? I’ll bet you wouldn’t think too much of it nor would you tend to be sympathetic to their views. You talk about your right to assemble but don’t forget their right to feel secure in their home. If you want to win the hearts and minds of the officers you won’t accomplish it this way. All you will accomplish is their further entrenchment and distain.
I would feel like I needed to reexamine my own choices, if a group of people were standing outside my house with candles protesting my actions. It wouldn’t matter if I were sympathetic to their views or not, obviously they did not show up for no reason. If they did not want anyone to come to their homes maybe they shouldn’t enact tyranny on others, wouldn’t you think? R, all you are doing is defending the evil acts of evil or misguided men. Why do you persist in this? What is so laudable about these particular men, that no one should protest the wrongs they do to others? Are they better than you, R?
R,
I wonder why all those people would feel the need to voice their concerns to their public officials on the weekend.
Maybe they have to work during the week and don’t have the time until the weekend?
I wonder what Burke and Eli Rivera did to make people hold a peaceful vigil in front of their homes on a weekend? You’d think people have better things to do, they must have done something really bad.
R, I’m in my own home right now, and your comment is making me uncomfortable! I demand you be kidnapped and robbed!
If I ever slam someone’s head and neck against a surface, and injury results – please hold a candlelight vigil for the victim, and demand restitution or at least an acceptance of blame and an apology from me.
Most important: great job countering force with peace. This vigil, even if not highly viewed on the youtube, was seen by the actual neighbors of these tyrant-followers. As was said before: how are they going to explain their disdain for people holding a candlelight vigil? How can they dehumanize the humane to justify their actions, and indeed their very livelihood?
i thought here would be the best place to post my reactions to last night, because it has the most chance of being viewed by those who i would want to see it.
first off, i have to say that many in ‘my own circle’ will disagree with me, and that’s perfectly okay. these are my opinions based on my beliefs, and i don’t expect anyone to adopt them because i say so. i think there were many miscommunications last night that created a situation i was not fully supportive of. the intentions i held when choosing to take part in this was to show these 2 men that they have crossed a line. they are no longer just ‘doing a job’, but effecting people in a very personal way.
burke is in a position of authority over others that was given to him without our consent. his personal feelings have become a motivator in what should be an impartial decision making process; and as a result, he is tearing apart families and subjecting people to a loss of freedom. this is evident from the fact that not one person on this earth could claim an injury, loss, or threat of imminent danger resulting from the actions of those people burke has put into jail.
rivera has also been given an unconsented position of authority over people, with the added authority to use physical violence without recourse. he has shown himself to have problems with managing his anger, which puts anyone who peacefully disagrees with his beliefs in a dangerous position. the most disturbing element (to me) is that when i watch the video of sam’s arrest, and i hear him screaming in pain… i can overlook the bad law, i can overlook the bad decision to enforce it, i can even overlook the mistake of improperly cuffing sam and causing him pain (if it was an accident)… but i CANNOT overlook rivera’s obvious enjoyment of sam’s pain. that causes me to feel pain on a personal level.
that is why i felt it would be beneficial to peacefully stand outside these two men’s homes with candles to remind them of the personal pain that results from their inhumane actions. legally acceptable or not, these men hurt people, and i want them to understand that.
that being said… had i known rivera was not home, but his family was, i would not have taken part. i don’t mind his family knowing how we feel; however, i do mind that because he was not home, our peaceful assembly there could easily be misconstrued as a threat to innocent people. this was in no way the intention of this vigil, but for a woman whose husband does things that people don’t like, seeing a group of those people gather in front of her home while he is gone can trigger the feelings of fear that our government and main stream media provoke in society. his family has nothing to do with any of us, and i am deeply sorry if they felt threatened in any way. i hope they understand that i hold nothing but good will towards them, and they should never feel threatened by me in anyway. i’d even go so far as to say that if a threat of danger ever did arise (which wouldn’t have come from this group, but i’m speaking ‘just in general’) i would do my best to protect them from harm. i believe in peace and love, nothing else. that is why i was there. to spread a message of peace and love, not to bring fear or anger to anyone, not even rivera himself.
while i understand that people may argue these vigils could have been done elsewhere, i think they wouldn’t had the potential effect that this was to create. it’s like setting up a ‘free speech zone’ miles away from a politician’s speaking event… the person you are trying to reach with you message can’t hear it. this was done to reach a PERSON, not address a political issue. these were people who hurt our friends and loved ones. the system may suck, but they choose to embrace it, and use it against us. i can reach millions of people with videos online, but this message was for burke and rivera.
if that message, one solely based on peace and love, was misinterpreted as a threat, then i ask that those who feel/felt threatened be aware that they will never be in harms way when i am around. i will not only never use violence or aggression against ANY human being, i will defend even those i disagree with from the violence or aggression of another.
Why do I persist with my line of thinking? The very same reason you do. It’s my opinion and what I believe. You don’t have to agree with it as I don’t with yours. I still find it a little naive that you think that these actions will win over the police officers and cause them to modify the way they do things. I think it will do just the opposite and come back and bite you at some point. But if you do believe it then more power to you I guess.
S,
Kidnapped and robbed? Pretty extreme I would say. Should I call 911 for you?
I hope this happens every night. What are they going to do to stop you? Don’t talk to the cops at all, and just stand outside the homes in silence until Kurt is released. I bet his comfort is much worse than the people who live in these homes.
Don’t bother to call 911, R, the same goons who do the robbing will show up.
just leave the men alone. eli is a good man, whether you wish to believe it or not. he did not purposefully break his neck by pushing him against the wall or whatever you guys think happened. people exaggerate. rivera needed to do his job by restraining the defendant. and, if the defendant had cooperated with the court in the first place, he wouldn’t have gotten the maximum penalty, and thus wouldn’t have broken his neck.
These candlelight vigils need to be Candlelight Caroling. Songs of love, peace, and forgiveness toward the violent enemies of Liberty.
And if you call me a hippy, I’ll throttle you! 
Not really 
@JlG:
“rivera needed to do his job”, please clarify the requirement of “need” and how it was achieved by the use of violence?
Also, I understand it might make you feel better but the blatant transparency here of you “blaming the victim” is insulting to anyone with half a brain.
For example: “She wouldn’t have gotten raped if she hadn’t been wearing that miniskirt she was really asking for it.”
Furthermore, whether or not a person is “good” is not a matter of belief, one way or the other. It is a matter of fact.
To clarify this for you, consider that just because some people believe that Hitler and Stalin were “good men” does not make their “goodness” a matter of belief.
You may hold the belief that Eli is a “good” man, and Eli may in fact have “good” intentions, but the fact is that a man leaves his mark on the world through his real and measurable actions, not his intangible intentions or beliefs.
Best of luck to you all.
We’re yet to see the fallout of these candelight vigils in front of government houses, but I think it was a terrible idea.
Now you’ve all given the public a reason to think the Keene activists are a threat. Talk all you want about how peaceful and principled you all are, but the public isn’t going to see it that way.
“A Gang,” one of the cops called you. I understand why he thinks that way. I know better, but that’s because I know many of you.
Peaceful assembly with candles is somehow threatening now?
I’ll support leaving the cops alone at their houses once they promise to leave us alone at our houses. As it currently stands, if I don’t pay their salary, they come and kick me out of my house. They don’t come and hold a peaceful candlelight vigil asking for my money, that’s for sure.
I’m sorry I left with a ride home now. A gang? Intimidating? What a laughingstock for Rivera’s family to claim feeling threatened when his career is predicated upon making others fearful of the things they do in the privacy of their home. Your violence and childish temper are finally coming back to you Eli. In the year I have been here and participating in local activism, I have seen nothing from this group that could REMOTELY be construed a ill-intentioned or violent. I have seen several instances of police violence and numerous instances of violence at large that the police have failed to prevent, nor have they apprehended or even determined those involved. In the past year, to my recollection, these include:
several stabbings
an arson on marlborough st.
an attack on an apartment with a molotov cocktail
two muggings in broad daylight, with descriptions of the suspects.
a rape
But they make sure to threaten somebody making dinner listening to music a bit too loudly. Arrest that hoodlum holding marijuana in his hand. Threaten all those nice folks with tables and instruments on public property. Intimidate those who refuse to stand for a man who frankly has done nothing to deserve respect, and everything to inspire contempt. Or get those damn kids out the court lobby. Confiscate those “instruments of crime” commonly called cameras. Lock a man away for months for refusing to play your sick game of supplication and obedience. Or smash Kurt’s skull into the wall.
The fact of the matter is, Eli, most people who interact with you or listen to your obesity-addled lying breath on the witness stand, have little if any respect for you. And I suspect that reason is an obvious personal vendetta you have against anybody you can label as a free stater, free keene, “subject” or your inferior.
Does your wife know you nearly broke a man’s neck because he wanted to give his own wife a hug before he was stolen away from her for SIX MONTHS? Last night’s vigil came to your doorstep because you are just a man who lives in Keene. You may be wrapped in this mysticism that surrounds your work costume and the state papacy that validates your violence, but you are still just a man – one that could use a shot of humility.
You should all be shot. Crossing a line from peace to overly present. If you were on my door step I would’ve come out swinging with my trusty louisville slugger.
Wow – how incredibly violent of you. No one was in danger, so no defensive force would be necessary.
Shyfrog: “These candlelight vigils need to be Candlelight Caroling. Songs of love, peace, and forgiveness toward the violent enemies of Liberty.”
I couldn’t agree more!
Wanna write me a melody?:
ROGATION
COPYRIGHT 2009 by Sam A. Robrin or whoever the hell it is who writes these things. Go ahead and use it, but if you make a little money on it, I want some!
You think we hate you,
But you’re wrong–
We hate the way you’ve trampled liberty so long.
Your hate we’re staunchly
Resentful of,
But we respond with pity, sympathy, and love.
You think we fear you–
No, not quite.
We fear the loss of freedom’s giving, guiding light.
It’s that spirit
We’ve vowed to save
With that to strengthen us, we’re nothing else but brave.
You think we’ll harm you–
That’s not true.
We’ll only stop the harm that’s done to us by you.
What you’re not seeing
When we resist
Is that you’re part of who we’re trying to assist.
You think we’re traitors.
So you say.
But there’s no treason in refusing to obey.
We’re demonstrating
With our Will nots
That we’re the actual impassioned patriots.
You think we’re adverse.
Not the case!
Come join us peaceably–just name the time and place.
We’ll greet you fairly–
It’s what we do–
And we’ll extend the hand of liberty to you.
I have a tune in mind for this one, but after my experience with the one above (I checked, DALE, and you were right . . .), I’d want to run it by a musician first!:
I WANT TO SAY
[size=6pt]COPYRIGHT 2009 by Sam A. Robrin or whoever the hell it is who writes these things. Go ahead and use it, but if you make a little money on it, I want some![/size]
Why does fighting for freedom matter so much?
What makes me think I must give it my own special touch?
It’s not a “Look at me!” advertisement,
Or a case of personal aggrandizement–
Ego doesn’t enter into the story:
There are lots of easier ways to earn glory.
BUT
I want to say
To the mirror, “Hey–
You did good.
“You heard the call
And you gave all
That you possibly could.
“You didn’t drag.
You didn’t lag.
You boldly carried the liberty flag.
“You forged ahead,
Sweated and bled,
Now you can deservingly hold high your head.”
When will liberty finally be a fact?
Where can I go to help keep it from being attacked?
I’ll keep searching until I can find
People of a like liberty-loving mind,
Fully cognizant of what they believe,
And together we’ll be what we want to achieve.
AND
I want to know,
In the grand tableau
Of liberty,
Parts that I played
Really were made
Special for me.
Know deep inside
That I sure tried–
My life will have meant something when I’ve died;
Know in my soul
I filled my role
The best that I could to accomplish the goal.
How great giving and clearly getting your best?
Who wouldn’t want to prolong that sheer feeling of zest?
Putting activism into action
Gives a damn near sexual satisfaction–
Similarly acts of procreation,
Making your mark on the world and nation.
SO
I want to be
True, able, and free
Here on this Earth;
Body and mind
Fully entwined
By rule of birth.
If I must fight
To earn that right–
If that’s the battle they choose to incite–
Then let them try
And, live or die,
I will have been true to the I that is I.
I can’t even believe this website and the direction the city of Keene is going. I grew up in Keene and never thought a bunch of losers would be able to act like this. From what I get from your website and your “videos” your all a bunch of pussies that are going in the wrong direction to accomplishing anything but being a nuisence. I’ll tell you if you showed up at my doorstep they’d be bringing bodybags because I would enact my second amendment right. Here’s an idea for you bunch of assholes put down the bongs and go down to the recruiters office and fight for this country that your trying to destroy and stop disrespecting the men and women serving this country AND ITS LAWS. They are dying so you can be MORONS. It disgusts me. I might actually plan a trip up north to see your little 420 BS. What are you gonna do when I put my fist in the back of your skulls and watch with laughter as the last one falls. Stop using the Rosa Parks card, you assholes are nothing like that extraordinary woman and your “cause” is nothing like the civil rights movement. And I’m guessing that MLKJ would be disgusted with the thought that you think it is. You whiners are going to keep it up and my fellow brothers in arms will keep dying for you. For all of them let me say to FUCK YOU!
I think this event must have been posted on a police blog or something. The crazy violent threats against peaceful activities are coming out of the woodwork.
Hey Dingdong,
I was just on the cool website no police blog so don’t get excited. As I stated I grew up in Keene, try to keep up I know your brains full of resin. You’re not peaceful but if that is what you need to tell yourselves to sleep at night.
I believe that marijuana should be legalized but I also believe that you are hurting this cause.
first off, i personally don’t believe the US Army is currently protecting me from anything, but i do appreciate that the those who think they are protecting my freedom would be so willing to do so.
but if they are willing to die for my freedom, wouldn’t it be disrespectful to not act like a free person?
What are you gonna do when I put my fist in the back of your skulls and watch with laughter as the last one falls.
I’m glad you came by tonight. It really reinforces to every single supporter that they are taking the correct paths with their lives, “being morons” and trying to destroy your country.
You need a hug?
To KEEPKEENESHACKLED:
Overtly violent, jingoistic nonsense like you spout IS the problem with this country. The real threats to freedom and liberty are found RIGHT HERE within our own borders, not thousands of miles away in a scrap of desert people have been fighting over for centuries. I did go down the recruiters office once, and they proved conclusively to be full of shit, and shameless opportunists more interested in threatening kids into “service” than listening to their real concerns about their own life.
Furthermore, your second amendment right is to keep and bear arms for personal defense, not for murdering people with candles. Your fellow brothers is arms will keep dying for a government that sees them as sacrificial animals and can’t even afford them the basic medical care they deserve for getting their legs blown off fighting another politicians war.
The “Rosa Parks card” is an allegory about mindlessly obeying bad laws simply because they are laws. Take every vicious name you called complete strangers in your tirade and replace it with NIGGER, and you’ll see precisely how it reflects the civil rights movement. Let’s do this exercise together:
bunch of losers (niggers) would be able to act like this.
all a bunch of pussies (niggers)
you bunch of assholes (niggers) put down the bongs…
I think you get it. It is a solid analogy, substituting one word for the other, because your intent was only to degrade, demoralize and deprecate individuals you have grouped together in your mind. Your purpose was to espouse hatred and threats of violence. The nouns you chose are irrelevant.
I respect every single service member who truly fights for freedom. You on the other hand seem to use it as a measuring stick for your manhood. When Rivera takes of his gang colors at night, he returns to a home where he is just a man and has neighbors that he is NOT superior to. The vigil was just a friendly reminder of that, and the fact that his actions have left a man in a questionable state of health – for which he has expressed no sympathy or regret.
If you can’t see that and only have the capacity for hatred and threats, then you are no better than the evil men you claim to protect the world from with your “laws and brothers in arms.”
IAWAI, No I don’t need a hug but Thanks for asking. And it’s not my country it’s our country. SMEG your a misguided individual if you don’t think your being protected from anything. I’ve got a great idea why don’t you guys take your 420 group international and see how it goes in Afghanistan. I’m glad that your stuck in your little box where your biggest concern is where to smoke your next bong. I guess the Armed Services are doing their job!
KEEPKEENESHACKLED,
You don’t have to go kill people in other countries for me to be free. It would be nice if you’d stop threatening to hurt peaceful people who haven’t harmed anyone, just because they don’t live their lives exactly the way you want them to.
THAT would be pro-freedom.
The reality is, you pay lip service to liberty, but you’re really right on board with tyranny — arbitrary control of governments over our lives.
I can’t even believe this post Josh. You’re way off base and I don’t know if it’s ignorance or stupidity. You have the right to assemble it’s in the constitution but when you move it to a person’s property you’re crossing a line that is more hurtful to your cause. You won’t see it that way of course. Josh you and I will have to agree to disagree because we see this country in two totally different lights. I want my family protected and to be able to sleep at night and you guys want to smoke pot where ever and live with no laws or government. If your world came to reality we would all be speaking Chinese, or Korean, or Arbic because we would be under someone else’s rule.
According to stuff I can see as an admin, KeepKeeneShackled = RuKidding = freddie
Hey RUKidding – why are you pretending to be more than one person?
KEEPKEENESHACKLED: Its not my country its just another landmass with a violent government holding dominion over the people living on it.
I don’t need the government’s armed forces to do anything for me I can keep myself free and safe from the boogey men you fear so much your willing to enslave yourself and everyone around you. (HINT you can’t trade liberty for security!)
Please get a life beyond forcing others to obey your rules.
Peaceful assembly with candles is somehow threatening now?
No. But of course you leave out the “in front of a cop’s house” part, in which case, the answer is Yes. It is threatening when a group of people show up at your house (or your neighbor’s house), with or without candles, with the obvious intention of airing their animosity and indignation. The fact that you were all holding candles does not negate the obvious.
You may feel completely morally justified in holding vigils in front of Rivera’s house, but that doesn’t mean the community is going to see it as peaceful and non-threatening. I’m not really thinking about Rivera or Burke here, but the public in general.
Public perception is tremendously important. If we aren’t trying to convert people, then what is the point?
Which raises the question: What exactly was the point of holding candlelight vigils in front of Rivera’s and Burke’s houses? I suspect the vigils were more about catharsis than anything else. Does someone care to challenge me on that point?
Comment by Ian
According to stuff I can see as an admin, KeepKeeneShackled = RuKidding = freddie
How could anyone be unable to see through so obvious a hoax name?
Kellie: I think its about showing that these thugs that they can’t just walk away after hurting innocent people that it will NOT be forgotten.
If a group showed up at my hose holding candles I would be very interested in speaking with them and having a open full dialog with the group since I don’t want a bad reputation.
But sadly government thugs don’t care about having horrible reputations they aren’t held accountable for there bad decisions.
comment by VIX
I think its about showing that these thugs that they can’t just walk away after hurting innocent people that it will NOT be forgotten.
A fine message, if it is effectively communicated.
I’m just rollin along watching this crazy crazy (feces). RUK, I recall most posters being quite civilized with you. You are not a nice person.
To KEEPKEENESHACKLED:
Once again, attacking the person instead of the argument. How you can equate people wanting to smoke a plant peacefully in the open with your family being under assault is ludicrous.
Laws and government that protect the rights and property of individuals is a fantastic proposition, and I’ll be glad to support it when that is what we have. The US government doesn’t even come close to fulfilling that basic duty. It is an all encompassing, micro-managerial behemoth that lives off the hard work and sacrifices of everyone it harasses. I didn’t attend that vigil at Rivera’s house but I know those who did and to claim to feel threatened by a group of people with candles is ridiculous.
Disagree all you want. We don’t see this country differently – we imagine the concept of “the country” differently. I see a political dominion dominated by a group of elitist politicians and their enforcers, laying claim over a broad swath of land stolen from its rightful inhabitants over centuries of war, lies, and oppression that have left a shameful legacy few want to talk about and I cannot blame them. I don’t now what YOU see when you think about “America”, but I will assume it is the “land of free, home of the brave” rhetoric that gives so many the warm and fuzzies.
How can a nation that imprisons over 700 million people a year (that have never harmed another living person) be called free? That is what the smoke-outs are about, not “the right to smoke pot.” How can a government that presumes to tell allegedly free people what they can and cannot do with their own bodies be considered free? How can a nation the steals nearly half of its citizens income under threat of raid, imprisonment and seizure of their rightful property be called free? Check your premises.
I don’t dispute the purpose of the military to provide a common defense. However, the US military has not fought a defensive war this century, or any of the last.
Declassified documents tell a story of a government that engineers engagements and stages coups in “uncooperative” nations. Google “Operation Northwoods” and be amazed. Educate yourself on the breadth of US intervention in Iranian affairs from the 1950′s onward. These people do not idly take up arms against the USA. They do it after decades of having fire and death rained down on them. Google images of “depleted uranium babies” and witness the silent genocide of the Iraqi people – an unintended after-effect of depleted uranium shells used in the Gulf War. Take the time to examine the rise of Saddam Hussein, the then darling of the US government. They were more than happy to train and supply him with all the arms he wanted to fight against the Iranians.
Do some research and understand that the US government (always claiming to be bringing democracy to the middle east) actively participated in a coup to overthrow Iran’s elected president (Mohammed Mossadegh), install a puppet regime headed by a brutal shah, and the subsequent islamic fundamentalist uprising that ignited the middle east. That is the reality.
Bin Laden was funded and trained by the US government to fight the Russian invasion of Afghanistan. Do you really expect these people to stop fighting american troops? they fought off the british. they fought russian gunships head on from the backs of camels. They don’t know what fear is. Accepting the official 9/11 story – that is the reason those attacks happened. It was a wake up call to the american people at large that a significant portion of the world has had enough of being occupied as a client state.
That is the role this country’s government has played and continues to play. I don’t doubt or discount the bravery of the fighting men on either side. That does not change the fact that these wars (raging for eight years) are predicated on lies. We would not be speaking Korean, German, or Japanese. You know this because real patriots would defend their homeland to the last man – they would rather burn then be held down.
It is impossible to take this monster down at the head, but the foundation on which it stands will not support it indefinitely. In getting back to the topic at hand, that is the point of any activism you read about. Reclaiming our sovereignty in our immediate vicinity, in a manageable scope that isn’t abstracted beyond meaning. And in doing so, hoping to inspire others to do the same.
Kellie, do you have a better idea? Because all I’ve seen outta you all day is ‘Oh, you’re right, but you can’t go over to the cops’ and judges’ HOUSES!! Cry-imminny!’
Guess what? Those people come to our houses, sometimes with warrants, sometimes without. Sometimes the warrants are related to perverted law. They feel themselves to be superior to ‘regular folk’, which clearly they are not, they are SERVANTS, not masters.
Seriously, what do you want us to do with these people, Kellie? Begging them obviously doesn’t work. Killing them obviously will not work. So they are being publicly shamed, in front of their own families, and exposed as tyrants in front of their families. They deserve much more, but have the power to destroy anyone who would give them what they really deserve.
So either come up with a better idea, or stand aside and let the people do what they must
@ LPVIPER
I invited people to challenge my accusation that this was all about catharsis. Your VERY emotional response only reinforces my suspicion that, at least in your case, I was right. Thanks for the clarification.
Maybe it was, in part, a cathartic event. Aren’t you glad those at the vigil chose a solemn, peaceful method rather than the violent catharsis Rivera so often opts for? I’ve seen this guy come off the handle too many times to see him as anything but a loose cannon. I’ve heard him lie on the stand too many times to take his word as anything of value.
@ Josh
Any activism is at least partially cathartic. That’s perfectly natural and inevitable. Yay that we can vent our frustration and anger in peaceful ways!
However…
There is something to be said for effective activism. Maybe the vigils were effective, but I’m pessimistic.
I’m speaking of myself as much as anyone else. I know what it’s like to think only of the morality of an action with no regard to strategy.
There is truth in what you say about catharsis, Kellie.
However, I will ask my question again, as you neglected to answer it previously.
Do you have a better idea?
Do you have a better idea?
You’ll have to phrase your question more specifically, because my answer depends on what the objective is.
Do I have a better idea for how to communicate to Rivera that his actions are immoral and that perhaps next time he should think twice before arresting and seriously injuring a peaceful man?
Well, I’d say that any candlelight vigil that doesn’t involve intimidating his wife would be a better idea. It might not end up in Rivera changing his world view, but at least it wouldn’t be reason for him to hate us even more and to further strengthen his (and likely his family’s) belief that Keene, NH would be better off if the Free Keene folk would just go away.
You shouldn’t consider my criticism an attack on you or your views. Any healthy liberty movement must welcome constructive criticism.
What more can I say to add to all the above!?…I’m proud of you people! I myself was first victimized by “loose cannon” Rivera in 1996! He was off-duty, & out of uniform(sweat suit…), we were in a class together at Franklin Pierce College – Keene Campus, when Rivera threatened, personally, to arrest me for “trespassing”…Looking back, I wish I’d taken him up on his offer…It would have gotten Court involvement sooner, while Hon. Richard J.Talbot(ret.) was still on the Kangaoo/Keene Court bench…Thanks, Ian, for the RUK/RUKIDDING = KEEPKEENESHACKLED = Freddie heads-up…in the interest of full disclosure, let it be known that theKINGofKEENE also answers to *ELKHEART/ELKFART*…God, I do so love you people! (WTF???…Yeah, I know, I’m a Tibetan (Mahayana) Buddhist – you know, that Dalai Lama guy – but I was born & raised Protestant Christian. I have easily reconciled both Buddha & Jesus/God with traditional American Indian beliefs, hence, “Native American Tibetan Buddhist”…Hey, it works for me!!!…As for candlelight vigiling at Burke & Rivera’s house, HEY! *GOVERNOR SMILEY-FACE*, YO! LYNCH-mob! Hey, Molly Kelly! *I *TOLD* YOU PEOPLE A YEAR AGO TO SHITCAN BURKE! I’ve done virtually *NOTHING* to support the “freestaters”…The “FSP” has done a better job of *PROVING MY VALID POINT*, than I could ever do by myself…”If the people lead, eventually the leaders will follow”…
Very interesting conversation with the police. Good job staying peaceful and polite.
To have fear isn’t always a bad thing for the person experincing it……..Sometimes the fear is irrational, and the problems that feed the fear are self created. If one can overcome creating there own problems then many fears just dissapate!
Killer work! Keep it up!
“eli is a good man” – No, he is not. Eli is an evil man. Every paycheck he receives is stolen money, money taken from taxpayers whether they consent or not. Every thing he does is violent. He represents the force and the brutality of the state. I have no respect for him, I have no respect for his job, I have no respect for his badge, I spit on the idea of him being a good man.
He is the Roman soldier stabbing Jesus in the side. He is the Inquisitioner torturing heretics. Rivera is the British redcoat raping patriot women and burning patriot churches. He is the Yankee soldier slaughtering Confederate children. He is the military force occupying 700 bases in 130 countries. He is not reason, he is not eloquence, he is force.
It seems disingenuous for Rivera to support Obama because he says they share the same beliefs that communities need to be stronger and more cooperative to achieve peace and prosperity, yet has a major freak-out when his NEIGHBORS visit his home to do just that.
Yes Eli, the peasants know where you live. *insert scary ghost sound* This is the logical outcome when you repeatedly harm peaceful people. You have yet to say ANYTHING about what you did to Kurt. Not a word. Show some courage and come out as a neighbor and a man instead of hiding behind your costume and that thin blue line. Come down to the Free Keene Festival this sunday and apologize. Actually talk to these people with whom you have created so much strife. Make amends. But do it as a man, not in your policing role. Endeavor to control your rage before it truly gets the better of you. Prove us all wrong in the judgment of your character.
I understand your example of showing real criminal cases that have been unsolved in Keene (or in your opinion) left without concern from the authorites. Someone cited a bunch of real crimes…. I for one think the KPD would have alot more time to solve these crimes if they didn’t have to deal with the daily BS of you all. While some of you praise the KPD for how they individually act around you, they are only doing that to avoid further conflict with you.
If I being a law abiding citizen get stopped for speeding and appear to be under the influence… If they find pot on me. Guess what I am going to jail. Your 420 vigil (which is less of a FSP and more local rebellious pot smoking kids) on the square is not changing any laws or the upcoming medical use bill is truly being hurt by your actions more than helping.
Furthermore, by taking the vigil to persons said private home, (Police Officer, Prosecutor or a Judge) you are essentially trepassing on that person and his families privacy outside and away from the organizational structure that you disagree with. In my opinion, you are not a gang but more of a terrorist group that are looking to instill chaos and civil unrest in a sleepy little town.
I suggest the KPD invite all the surrounding PD’s and gather up all of you at todays 420, so you can spend some time with your (run into the court room post) ring leader in the no heat / no hot water county jail.
Just go away, 98% of Keene think you and your Free State Project are a burden on the system in which they fund… otherwise you would have 24,000 members strong instead of maybe a couple hundred.
Wyatt,
What side are you on? Do you want liberty for all or for master’s rules to be obeyed by all?
Don’t be a tool.
Wyatt,
Got news for you – rather than going away, more activists are coming. Perhaps you should try learning a thing or two about freedom, else YOU may want to consider leaving, because things are only going to get more free around here. It’s only a matter of time.
Oh, and how impressive that you speak for 98% of Keene. You must really be a man about town!
Wyatt belched forth thusly:
… If they find pot on me. Guess what I am going to jail. Your 420 vigil (which is less of a FSP and more local rebellious pot smoking kids) on the square is not changing any laws or the upcoming medical use bill is truly being hurt by your actions more than helping.
Kids? Kids you say? I’ve been coming to the square every day since the 2nd day of the gathering. I’m also 48 and have 3 grandchildren. I’m no kid, dude. My kids aren’t even kids. That is just your prejudices talking.
You obviously know nothing about what you are talking about. Happy 4:20 to you anyway.
C. Munro
Wyatt, they don’t have to “deal” with activists, they could just let people who have not harmed others be.
Focusing on these things is their own decision. Yours is a common tack in defending immoral behavior — blame the victim, and pretend that the bad actor had no choice in the matter. For example, I’ve heard burke referred to as a truck — e.g. “You don’t go stand in front of a truck and get hit, why would you question a judge in a courtroom?” The fact is, the judge is not a force of nature, or an inanimate object, he is a person with moral responsibility for his own actions, and so are the cops.
Blame the victim and have no choice in the matter? “Whats your last name?” I believe was the question posed. He refused and was held in contempt of court.
You got one thing right, the “bad actor” part.
Instead of knocking on the door, it would have been cool if the activists sang this song to get their attention:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHmUPqI6w9g …
or other songs of peace/freedom.
Wyatt, the judge had forced him to be there under duress in the first place, and he had not harmed anyone. The idea that we all need to obey whatever arbitrary diktats the man in the black robe, or politicians in concord come up with is absurd.
If I made a bunch of arbitrary rules for your life, I would have no right to throw you in prison because you did not follow them. And yes, you have the right not to tell me your last name.
As I say, I’ve heard of some other people who like to enforce “respect” by threatening violence, but they’re all gang members.
He was forced there under duress? So did he not break a law to begin with. Last time I checked a traffic violation is a law in which is broken. Most people do not end up in court over a violation, as they admit their fault of doing something wrong. The fact is you call out certain things as “real crime” and others as not crime at all. So running a stop sign is not a crime until you do so and hurt a pedestrian? The underlying root cause is the same, without the personal injury?
I live under the arbitary rules called the law, which happens to be enforced by the Keene Police Department. My tax dollars fund the services and as End Game has stated, I too am happy with the services I get.
Now your selection of examples is ironic, as you have absolutely no right to make any arbitary laws or remove what you personally feel is inappropriate.
As for your opinion on respect, I will agree to disagree. But for the most part should anyone have a different opinion than yours, it is considered wrong.
Heres mine, given the fact that you are attempting to cause civil unrest to the fine community of Keene, (as you have targeted Keene, New Hampshire only) you are not “a gang” as stated but more of a terrorist group or militia attempting to create an uprising in an already civil society, (whatever you or anyone else’s goal maybe) therefore in todays world you are the minor leaguers of the world’s biggest terror concern.
Civilized people don’t demand tribute
Wyatt: Terrorist! “LMAO” I think you mean the state/government when you speak that word I don’t see any violence/force being done by the liberty activists in NH.
Now the government on the other hand only has force/violence to get what it wants done.
The only moral use of violence is defensive. If I am going to use force on someone, it had better be in self defense — otherwise I have become the attacker. Just laws prohibit real crimes with victims — like assault, theft, rape, murder, arson, etc. The use of force in response to these things is defensive — because the original acts constitute an attack.
The proper use of law — which is the threat of violence, make no mistake about it — is not to force people to obey whatever arbitrary rules bureaucrats in concord want to come up with. Using the threat of violence on people to extort money from them, or to make them live a certain way, would be immoral for any individual or any group, and it’s immoral for government. Using force in this way to effect arbitrary control is tyranny.
Slowly rolling through a stop sign in a rural area does not in itself constitute anything close to reckless behavior, or endangerment of others. The reality is, enforcement of these rules in most circumstances is about revenue generation.
Pulling someone over is a use of force — the implication is that if you don’t stop, violence will be used. If a cop is going to stop someone driving, then that person needs to be putting others in eminent danger, or they need to have harmed someone. This would make the use of force defensive.
Certainly, if he had hit a pedestrian it would have been a real crime — but as far as I can tell he was driving safely for the conditions. Most importantly, we know he didn’t harm anyone, because there is no victim bringing charges. And, even if there were a victim, the money should go to that victim as restitution. The state is certainly not a victim, so they have no right to demand money.
If you are happy with the services you’re getting from your taxes — for example, say you think the public schools are great — you absolutely have the right to use your money to keep subscribing to these services. I just ask that you allow others to make a different choice, with their own money. You own your money, and have a right to spend it as you like, and others own their money, and have a right to spend it as they like.
I don’t believe in violence at all, so your last comments are frankly absurd. Terrorists attempt to accomplish their goals by instilling fear in others. I don’t want to instill fear in anyone. Unlike government, I respect people’s property rights, and freedom to spend their own lives and finances as they choose.
Actually, by that definition, current government behavior is most terrorist. They extract money from people by threatening to take their homes. They force people to obey arbitrary rules (e.g., prohibition on unpasteurized milk) by threatening to put them in cages. It’s obvious with any objective thought that today’s principal source of aggressive threats, and the use of fear to control behavior, is government itself.
I was born in Keene, by the way, so there’s another dimension of failure in your ludicrous “attack” rhetoric.
I suggest Bastiat’s “the law” would be a good start in understanding purpose of legitimate law, and the dangers of its perversion: http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html
i think a big distinction that many on the side of ‘the law’ or ‘the state’ miss is the fact that we don’t want to change what they believe… we only want them to consider the fact that we don’t believe the same thing.
if you think that taxes, traffic laws, the drug war, US troops in other countries, the government system etc… are good things (or maybe just some of those are good things to you), that’s your belief. i disagree, but i’m not gonna do anything to you for disagreeing with me. however, why am i not allowed to live the way i believe is right? why should i be forced to obey the rules of a system i never agreed to be a part of? why should i pay for things i despise? for example, whenever i go to the airport, there is a man (never a woman) who gets to grope my breasts to check for… i don’t even know. i am forced to pay for my own sexual assault. sure i could waste a few years worth of time, money, and energy to MAYBE get that part of airport screening taken out… or i could just tell the guy to keep his hands off me.
thats what we are doing here. telling angry strangers and people we don’t want touching us to keep their hands off. i don’t care what a person’s job is, they are still just a person. i don’t see anyone as an authority in my life, because i don’t believe people can be given control over another without consent. i never consented to anyone controlling me. if you did, then enjoy your system, but don’t force it on me. and if someone hurts those i love, i will deal with them in a direct (but peaceful) manner. i can’t separate the person from the uniform, or buy their excuse of ‘just doing their job’. that stuff doesn’t apply to me, cause i don’t believe in their system.
Sometimes I bring my work home too. And it also intrudes on my quality family-time! So what’s the big deal?
Although I am in a different line of work; sadism is not in my job description.
I think it is horrible to do this to a family’s home. You are compromising their rights to quiet enjoyment. If you have a beef with a public official in the course of his job, adress it at the place of employment or in a public forum a city council meeting. If I was him, I would have had a sudden need to turn on a sprinkler and maybe hose down the road in front of my house. You guys are just looking for conflict so you can push back and scream about the alleged mistreatment. Remember, a citizen is allowed to use deadly force to defend his home and curtilage against unlawful force in the commission of a felony. Watch which lines you cross.
John,
If you have a beef with a public official in the course of his job and you work 9 to 5 you don’t have the luxury of addressing it at their place of employment. Because they are not open for business.
People have to earn a living.
Maybe that’s something the government could do, hold office hours after the majority of the people are not at work. That is the way most businesses work. Walmart is open after people are done with working for the day, maybe government could do the same?
A citizen is not allowed to use force against peaceful people holding a vigil for a friend that is in prison and/or has been injured.
The police came out to the peaceful vigil and did nothing because people were peaceful and did not do anything wrong.
It’s not against the law to care about your fellow human beings.
Sorry …”Liberty”,
I just cant believe all you peaceful people are just being all sweetness and light about some ones well being. You all have a hidden agenda and time will bring it out. Wal mart is a bad example in this case. They are the most corrupt business imaginable and infringe on peoples liberties by the minute. USe the example of a small locally owned business. They often keep hours similiar to public offices and imagine this…people find time to get to them. I guess its all a matter of how important you feel it is to get to the office or business in question. I cant help but laugh when I think of that comment in the context of all the buffons wandering in our public parks at 4:20 getting stoned and breaking the law….
Peaceful vigil in front of the person’s home while parading around with a public display of guns. The family is not the person in which you have a beef with. Do you think they allow someone to do a certain job? Many dislike the employment one has, or the hours they work, the pay they recieve, the labor or acts in which they do… You are doing this to cause unrest (but you call it a peaceful vigil) in your one sided mindset, but you are actually looking for confrontation to cry foul. Take your vigil to the County Farm and call out to your master… Oh wait nobody up there cares, no media, no public confrontation possible because the guards who hold your master don’t care about you or your position.
In the defense of Eli: If his wife decided to leave, or walk outside while holding your peaceful vigil, bet your butt you will look for confrontation to cry assault and battery if touched. Heck, we seen that already with the dumbass stunt with the camaeras at the court. If you were to infringe on my children’s safety or well-being, guarantee you’ll see a different level of confrontation.
Thank you wyatt for a well stated position.
There is nothing wrong with standing and holding candles on public property, near someone’s home. If your “job” during the day is tackling people sitting in a chair in handcuffs and sending them to the hospital, or locking people in cages for asking you to say “please”, then yes, the very least you should expect to see is people holding a peaceful candlelight vigil outside your home.
Wyatt, if Rivera or Burke recognize that what they do is wrong, they should quit. If they “don’t like it” on a moral basis, the last thing they should be doing is keeping on despite their consciences. People doing immoral things just because it’s their job have been the source of most atrocities in modern history.
I don’t know who you’re referring to by “your master”. I have no human master, I am a free man.
If you want to know the motivation, I suspect for many it was the same as for most protests: to make the parties in question aware of the evil of their actions.
How is your last statement a defense of Eli? Yours is a made up scenario that did not even occur. And what occasion would his wife have to “touch” anyone?
Cameras in the court, by the way, are vital for any sort of accountability.
Certainly, it would be unacceptable for anyone to harm you or your kids. No one was harmed here, it was just a vigil — people standing on a public street holding candles.
I find it ironic that you’re so sensitive to the slightest perceived hint of even a peaceful protest regarding your master Rivera, but he can tackle a person in handcuffs and nearly break their neck, and you’ve got nothing to say about that. Your master Burke responds to people who haven’t harmed anyone, but “disrespect” him, or don’t show him the proper level of obsequiousness, by throwing them cages for months, and you’ve got nothing to say about that. No, it’s people holding candles that are the real problem.
Keep on bootlicking, the leather softens up after a while.
Lets get something straight seeing I have nothing to say about something you called me on.
Your camera guy was in the court room. The camera starts filming him laying on the floor supposedly post attack, in no distress. So it leads everyone to assume an assault occured. How about he may have ran into that support column to appear injured by authorities?
The next fact is his neck wasn’t almost broken, he was in and out of the hospital in minutes so unless the medical staff at the Cheshire Medical Center have Mother Theresa “healing powers” it was a frigging act.
In one of the many videos you can see him laying on the floor in no pain, turning his head left and right without neck pain and even sits up without the use of his hands and extend his neck out to kiss his wife.
Now I am not medically trained but hell even I can tell his neck is clearly no where near “almost broken”.
But when the video is rolling in front of all his disciples, “ahhhhhhhh the pain, Riveria tackled me.” This video has seen gotten it’s mileage and any educated person would realize the act is just that poor acting.
Wyatt, the video of him lying on the floor occurred before the attack. Just watch the video — he gets wheeled into the back room AFTER he was lying on the floor, and that’s when the attack occurs.
Wyatt,
Did you actually watch the video? Or is your memory just really bad?
Paul is correct, your time line is off.
Very good points Wyatt. They will fail, unfortunatley legislation in process to quell their activism, or at least make it more costly for them will affect those of us who are OK with status quo.
Hoffman is a terrible actor and a pussy, it is very hard to break a human neck. A signifigant force is needed, We have rugby games played daily and I have yet to witness a broken neck. Weak
Wyatt & John good to see you here to defend our community.
Unless I am mistaken all of you who are telling us what terrible things happened to Kurt didn’t actually witness the event. The incident if you can call it that happened behind closed doors. You are relying on hearsay or worse “assuming” that is what happened. I don’t think there is much question that Kurt has an agenda. I wasn’t there either but what I am saying is you need to at least consider the fact that his display was all an act to get attention. He certainly played it up well for the cameras when they were wheeling him out. How long was he in the hospital? If he really had a broken neck he would still be there or more likely airlifted to a major medical center. Look at the facts and don’t try spinning them to meet your needs.
We would know everything without question if cameras were not banned from these locations (and many others), but the government agents fear everyone seeing them in action.
That tells me that they will as soon as the eyes are off of them hurt people and break there own rules.
Yes, it is too bad there wasn’t a camera there. But if Kurt was pulling a stunt it would have prevented him from doing so as well.
That tells me that they will as soon as the eyes are off of them hurt people and break there own rules.
You are “assuming” again. The eyes were off Kurt as well.
R, if government employees don’t have anything to hide, then why are they trying so desperately to prevent themselves from being filmed? One would think that they’d *want* to be on film if they’re doing their jobs properly so that there would be no doubt.
Why would one try to prevent being filmed?………
Probably to avoid being recognized by someone who disagrees, and in turn being harasses at there home. Gee, That might be a good reason
His neck wasn’t almost broken, he was cleared by the hospital in minutes so unless the medical staff at the Cheshire Medical Center have Mother Theresa “healing powers” he was obviously not injured.
Why aren’t you holding a vigil at the hospital because they must have conspired to cover up the governmetal abuse of a innocent man’s broken neck and didn’t provide proper care or treatment, right?
Oh wait, if you do that on hospital grounds, you will be arrested for trespassing. And “no cameras allowed” so better stay focused on Riveria thats working.
Seems your following is questioning the cause.
His wife was there too, and someone else saw it, I can’t remember who. Basically, Rivera tipped his chair over, and since his hands were cuffed behind him, he couldn’t catch himself and his head hit the ground, snapping his neck back.
You guys really are desperate to make excuses.
Newsflash: Your “community” is not defined by the behaviors of a couple thugs, and defending them is not defending it.
This situation would not be an issue without two factors:
1) illegal contempt proceeding by the judge, who has already gotten away with such abuses
2) excessive force used by the police prosecutor, who also has a history of such conduct.
These specifics pull us away from the perversion of law that created the problem in the first place.
Simply consider whether the actions of Burke or Rivera would have been legal if you yourself had done them, outside the ‘color of law’, whatever the hell that is.
If you say no, DING! Perverted law, move to eliminate, and not only that, but file criminal charges against the tyrants.
Your activism is a disgrace to our community, it is childish and not what Keene is about. We have always had tremendous civic pride, and have always respected our police. The storm clouds are brewing, citizens are complaining, and appealling to our police department for action. You have awoken a sleeping giant….and the results could be costly to your cause. Your exodus is going to happen, the question is when, and at what personal cost.
And true to form, the response is threats against the people who just want freedom.
Your war will be one sided when taking on those who have no wish to fight with you.
You have ignored every bit of logic profferred and responded with derision and threats.
You are proving the case of liberty lovers with every ignorant word you type.
Read Fredric Bastiat’s ‘The Law’ and attempt to enter the conversation with an actual take.
Peace and long life
“We have always had tremendous civic pride, and have always respected our police.”
End Game, it’s very arrogant of you to try to speak for everyone who lives in Keene.
@ThinkLiberty – you claim that “A citizen is not allowed to use force against peaceful people holding a vigil for a friend that is in prison and/or has been injured.”
Think about it another way. What if the people that put Kurt in a cage did not have badges? If a random group of people kidnapped him and kept him in a cage? Would you still say the same thing?
These people were not given extra rights simply because they have a piece of metal on their outfit. They are still – as individuals – accountable for their actions.
They are given legitimacy in the eyes of a misled public, Pete.
That has always been the problem.
Maybe thinkliberty needs to read ‘The Law’ too.
Or maybe the problem will begin to solve itself as the ‘law enforcers’ are increasingly perceived as the bullies they actually are.
Whats up doc
I dont speak for everyone…….just conveying what everybody I am aquainted with seems to feel….and yes I am arrogant
There is an expression, speak truth to power. It seems that few in Keene were aware of the savage abuses of Burke and his gang – the blue light gang – and it is good that someone is bringing it to light. I see nothing wrong with the candlelight vigil, and found it to be quite peaceful and respectful. I look forward to many more, with more singing, too, until Rivera is fired and Burke stops being such a fool as to not realize that everyone deserves respect, and telling someone “please” if they ask, without question, or hesitation. No person deserves any more respect than another. Or less.
Rivera will not be fired
That much is likely true. The system is built by criminals to protect criminals.
I think you’ll see that End Game’s opinions are shared by many more citizens of Keene than you realize.
R,
Are you claiming that the will of the majority is supreme?
Hi R,
I think you should know what a ‘citizen’ is to the government before you go labeling folks.
Part of liberty is not having to care what others think as long as you aren’t harming them.
That’s why these municipal corporations have no interest in liberty.
They just want your cash and your obedience, and they get it by turning one group of ‘citizens’ against another, so that they can fund their courts and their jails and their oversized police bureaucracies, and whatever other market functions they can force monopolies on to benefit their pals and punish their enemies.
And you ‘civic pride’ types just eat that shit up.
I’d laugh if it weren’t so dangerous and wrong.
…I’m a Keene native, and multiple victim of KPD excesses.The Keene Policwe have a very poor reputation. As a group, they are known for being arrogant, rude, unprofessional, and yes, like Eli Rivera and Fred Parsells, and Randy Tefft, they delight in the sadism of their warped personalities. Tefft, while on-duty on bicycle patrol, once said to me: “I have special powers…”, when I chided him for running a red light on West St. /// Rivera has several times abused his badge by engaging in repeated acts of official oppression against me. Yes, on a personal level, there are many fine KPD officers. Many who are average schmucks like the rest of us. And a very few, like Rivera, who should not be in Law Enforcement at all. They are the *ROTTENEST APPLES*, and their evil, yes, *EVIL*(You’re an EVIL little man, Rivera! Either accept that fact, or accept God’s Grace, and REPENT, SINNER!, REPENT…)has corrupted the whole force. For far too long, GOOD COPS have covered for, and suffered from, BAD COPS. Rivera is a BAD COP. He should be fired. But let’s not fool ourselves. The rot starts at the top. Repeat: *THE ROT STARTS AT THE TOP*!…We should also be seeking the retirement of *”CHIEF” ART WALKER*…”BY their fruits shall ye know them…”…Art Walker has TOO MANY ROTTEN APPLES in his barrel…As for you “keene natives/locals” who are such good little apologists for wrong, your fear is palpable…Your angry invective is proof. If you’re not scared, why are you so angry? Your threats are laughable. You can spout off all you want on the safety and security and anonymity of the internet, but none of you have any real courage in real life/”meat space”. Show up at the 420 rally to counter-protest? You won’t. Show up and identify yourselves? You won’t. Show up to “protect” Burke’s & Rivera’s homes? You won’t. You’re empty rhetoric, End Game, Wyatt, R/RUK, &etc…Bluster all you want. I shall not be moved…And I bet Mr. Rousmaniere at the Keene Sentinel is sure regretting his decision to publish excerpts from my copyrighted spoken word performance…”…there’s a $10,000 bounty/contract on Eli Rivera’s head…Put out by the Hell’s Angels…You waste Rivera, the Hells’ Angels pays you $10,000!…”…HEY! I read that in the Keene Sentinel, Nov. 22, 2005! It MUST BE TRUE! The Sentinel only prints the TRUTH, right!?…What did *THAT* story do to Rivera & his family???…this shit will *NEVER END*…Resign or fired, Walker & Rivera. You better get while the getting’s good…Go find William Albrecht…he’s prolly schmoozing with *DOMBROWSKI*!…look *THAT* up in your local Law Enforcement Hall of Shame archives…also, “Carl Baird”/”Roger Santaw”…this shit will *NEVER END*…
I’d also like to take a moment to respond to Kellie’s post #83802.
She said in response to a question I had previously posed which was something like ‘do you have a better idea?’ because she objected to the candlelight vigils in front of the tyrants’ homes:
‘Well, I’d say that any candlelight vigil that doesn’t involve intimidating his wife would be a better idea. It might not end up in Rivera changing his world view, but at least it wouldn’t be reason for him to hate us even more and to further strengthen his (and likely his family’s) belief that Keene, NH would be better off if the Free Keene folk would just go away.
You shouldn’t consider my criticism an attack on you or your views. Any healthy liberty movement must welcome constructive criticism.’
I say to this, why was his wife intimidated at all? (In asking I assume that she was, or that she made the call to the police. Please correct me if I am in error) Why didn’t she think that they were there to cheer for her man, who is such a pillar of the community? MY answer is, she probably knows better.
The stuff you said about the police and their families wanting “the FK folk” to go away, well, whatever. That’s kinda what happens when one gets too close to a bee hive.
Kellie, you have the right to your criticisms and I have the right to reject them. While I won’t go so far as to say I have done so, I hope I have given you something to think about.
Peace and long life
KingofKeene,
You should end your posts with ‘Love and Kisses’ or ‘Scented Bubble Wishes’ or somesuch. I fear that people will think you a Negative Nellie.
You have a reputation to defend after all
“Love and kisses”???…”scented bubble wishes”???…Are you trying to seduce me, again, LPVIPER???…you almost suceeded w/that one post a while back…I’d prefer to end my posts with a more potent, & pungent thought: “I support the imminent military coup”…I’m a member of the Public Relations / Misinformation / Disinformation Unit, so I can get away with telling you all that…///…As for all the folks who post on here to express their opposition to the “freestaters” / 420 crowd, etc, Did you ever notice how they *ALWAYS* say something like, “You’re hurting your cause!”…If they are so *AGAINST* us Liberty / Freedom Activists, why are they so concerned that “we’re hurting our cause”???…Seems they’d just shut up, & let us hurt our cause……End Game / KeepKeeneShackled, & etc. are all fear-based persons, and, *THEY SECRETLY SUPPORT US*….Most Keene cops support us, too, even if they are afraid to openly admit that fact…&For the record, my current status is “IDP”…I’m an *Internally Displaced Person”…I’d call in a helo extraction rescue, but I know how much the black helicopters scare you people…Most of us local Keene folks really do enjoy all the free entertainment! C’est la vie!….(I know you all will, but, let me just say: Keep it peaceful!…)LOVE & KISSES & SCENTED BUBBLE WISHES & HOW LONG YOU GONNA KEEP ME WAITIN’, WOMAN?!?!?!….*grin*…
Um, I’m not a woman, but, other than that one of your less confusing posts
Kudos?
Ok.. you want a first hand account of what happened? Here I am. I am the wife of the man Eli Rivera nearly crippled on Fri. Oct. 2nd. I was there and I was also in the room when the attack occurred. In fact, in the audio you can hear me scream in horror when I saw Eli knock him head first into the wall and then over some chairs. He landed on his head because he was handcuffed and unable to defend himself in any way from being shoved. Was it an act or was he faking? NO! Was he able to defend himself? NO! And Yes.. he very easily could have had a broken neck from the impact but after almost 3 hrs of examination and testing the hospital concluded he did not. I was told he had a concussion and contusions on the head. That, coupled with spinal and neck injury from being forced into the ground, he is now sitting in a wheel chair while locked up in jail. Oh.. and did he have some sort of an “agenda?” Sure, I guess you could say that if you want to call wanting to give someone a HUG, an agenda. What a great system we have. They’re only there to protect us, huh?
BTW…. SILENCE IS CONSENT. Are we not our brother’s keeper?
I will never consent to a tyrannical system or group of men or any one man, who sees evil as good and good as evil. You cannot call violence, peace and call peace, violence. God is not the author of confusion.
Who will STAND UP for the TRUTH?? Who will give PEACE a chance? I’m not talking about violence and war in the “guise” of peace and safety. I’m talking about TRUE PEACE.
OPEN YOUR EYES.. we have been duped to believe a LIE. God help us all!
Thank you, research101, for the clarification. I wanted to hear what went down from an eyewitness
You have no lives… if you go to someones house and stand out their with candles…like its actually going to do something…wow…
Thank you Research101 and I am SO sorry this happened.
I hope and pray for his speedy recovery and safe release from jail.
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