Lady Keeniacs to Destroy the Liberty Movement!

Topless(FYI-those girls in the pic don’t live in Keene, and are actually wearing pasties. Click for the full version.) Apparently just having some ladies discuss the idea of a liberty event wherein women and men would go topless in public has already begun the next activist “schism”. If you’ve been paying close attention to the movement for a while, you’ll recall the first “schism” was between the politcos and the agorists. There was much forum drama, but the end result was that another forum was born, and the agorists (outside-the-system activists) had a place of their own. Most people still get along just fine, and many still mix their activism between both worlds, but there was much drama and sometimes it still raises its head.

This time, the ideological split is between the sexist prudes and their apologists (it’s not fair of me to call the apologists prudes – some claim to not be) and the freethinkers or as we have been labeled, by the apologists, “libertines”.

A single forum post was all it took to ignite the beginning of the end of the liberty movement. I could cite the absurd excuses to continue the oppression of women that some of these supposedly liberty-oriented posters have made, but you should just see the forum thread for yourself.

How do you feel? Shouldn’t females have the right to go topless in public just as males have long enjoyed? Seems like a no-brainer to me. These liberty ladies are in the right, and I will proudly walk beside them.

So, prepare for the end of the liberty movement as you know it, presuming you believe the apologists. If some naked breasts is all it takes to kill a movement, maybe it deserves to die. The irony is, liberty guys have been bitching for decades about the lack of women in the movement. Now a few of them show up in Keene, New Hampshire, decide to do this as their activism, and all of a sudden they are a liability? Sad.

My prediction is this could be the most popular activist event yet in New Hampshire, and that many other non-prudish freethinkers will be attracted to the Keene area as a result. Plus, I hope KPD does the right thing, and leaves these wonderful, courageous ladies alone. Though I wouldn’t blame them if they showed up with cameras to “gather evidence” for “investigation later”!

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84 Comments

  1. I fully support topless women. Do you have more pictures?

  2. Let it be noted that I, as a Free Keene blogger and media producer, oppose this post.

    This "event" is not scheduled or even supported by many "Lady Keeniacs" I've talked to. Ian has had a lapse in judgement to feel he can speak for them or put them on the spot for entertaining this idea in casual conversation.

    Not to mention such an event, if held, is detrimental to people taking our ideas seriously. Show me ONE family who has been torn apart over someone being arrested for their shirt being off, and I might change my mind.

  3. Settle down Nick.

    The post clearly states "some ladies discuss the idea". Not all the ladies, not an announcement of an event, nor does he claim to speak for anyone but himself. Frankly, I think you have the lapse of judgment in your comment.

  4. The topless protest is great and the counter-protest of private property is equally as great. Excellent ideas you all!

  5. Bring it on!

  6. Nice to have your support on this, Jasmine.

  7. "Shouldn’t females have the right to go topless in public just as males have long enjoyed? "

    Of course. I believe in most Canadian provinces there is legal protection for topless femlales (though it is rarely seen in public) and society isn't crumbling as a result. Then again Canadians are a bunch of liberal crazies with our topless women, marjiuana smoking and same-sex marriage.

  8. Comment by nick

    Not to mention such an event, if held, is detrimental to people taking our ideas seriously. Show me ONE family who has been torn apart over someone being arrested for their shirt being off, and I might change my mind.

    Nick,

    Its not a matter of if it has happened yet. What matters is that it has the potential to happen to anyone and that makes the law wrong. That any family COULD ever be torn apart because of any stupid law that should never have existed in the first place, is the point. Even putting people in jail for "unpaid parking tickets" has the potential for tearing families apart.

    To rid ourselves of a bad law you must eventually confront the state with the evil of it.

  9. A protest like this has the potential to get national headlines, and bring a lot of people to the FSP.

    The fact that this is so controversial among alleged "liberty activists" is, while unsurprising, disappointing to me. Didn't Voltaire say "I disagree with women going topless, but I'll fight to the death for their right to go topless." However, it's precisely the controversy that would help get this into major media.

  10. One has already deleted his forum account and canceled his $6 FTL AMP subscription.

    The schism has begun!

  11. Wow thats crazy. Over breasts? Whoever killed their account must have never seen any and been very very afraid

    Grow up, whoever you are. Breasts never hurt anyone. In fact, I've seen little babies sucking on them! Maybe we should arrest or ostracize the babies?

  12. All of the people who are against this idea seem to be men. That is strange. Everyone who supports it also seem to be men. Oh well….

  13. I don't understand why Americans freak out over nudity.

  14. That picture does a fine job in demonstrating the hypocrisy of the whole current legal situation. A piece of plastic the size of a nipple, placed on the nipple—that looks like a nipple itself—is the difference between legal and illegal?

  15. As a european, I do not see how sex or nudity is offensive. What is offensive to me is people freaking out over the idea of saying a dirty word, talk about sex or being naked.

  16. You guys are a bunch of stinkin' bigenders. I can tell! 😛

  17. Maybe there's a way to combine topless women and paying taxes with $1 bills. Boobs and dollars just go together….

  18. I don't consent to people restricting other peoples' rights to wear or not wear what they wish. On my land of course I can restrict what I wish. On other peoples' land I don't care.

  19. I find it amazing how many activists are concerned they might actually offend someone.

    As far as someone having their life ruined for exposing their breasts, this isn't exactly someone gardening topless. It is however pretty ruinous and was based on nothing more than a woman being topless around her own children (in her own home) and committing the indecent act of breastfeeding one of them:

    "Fernandez took several photos of the boys 'playing around,' naked and innocent, with the oldest flashing a big smile. Mercado, who says she often bathed with the kids, is in several of the shots unclothed from the waist up, holding her arm modestly across her bare chest.

    In one–the photo that would threaten to send Mercado and her boyfriend to prison–the infant Rodrigo is suckling her left breast." http://www.dallasobserver.com/2003-04-17/news/1-h

    This one is a little closer to the innocent gardener scenario. I don't know how much of her life was ultimately ruined, but a case that has to be appealed all the way to a state supreme court is no picnic to deal with:

    "In this case, Lorien Bourne was arrested and convicted merely for appearing topfree at a Bowling Green city park. It was not an ostentatious or salacious display; on a warm day she simply engaged in a picnic without a shirt on, as any man is able to do without fear of arrest." http://naturistaction.org/AlertsAdvisoriesUpdates

    Considering that some convictions require listing on sexual offenders' lists, even something as minor as a simple indecent exposure arrest has the potential to destroy an innocent person's life. Regardless, the threshold for opposing a law shouldn't be the requirement that someone's entire life was ruined by it. Nor should the fact that most people don't mind complying with it be a reason not to oppose an unjust law.

    With the recent propensity for "baggy pants" laws and charging of teenager girls with child pornography for sending unwise pictures of themselves to their boyfriends (or the boyfriends for receiving them), my suggestion would be to make it more of a broad based anti-sexual freedom/nudity laws rally. I think that would have a wider appeal without a lot of the "we'll scare away people who would never be interested in us anyway" type of opposition from within.

    Otherwise, I'm all for it.

  20. The porcine aspect of Ian's personality seems to be rearing its ugly head, as he once again reveals the adolescent prism through which he views women, i.e., as sex objects. Ever wonder why there's only a shrine of FEMALE listeners on the FTL site? Because we all know that the most important thing about women is being able to look at them! And of course there are all sorts of protests a group of women could undertake to publicize why women's concerns can be particularly well-met by adopting the principles of the so-called "liberty" movement. But the protest under consideration is the one that's most satisfying to the 13 year-old male mindset: get some women to show their breasts! Anybody surprised?

    Exercise care, folks; while the threat of the swine flu has no doubt been exaggerated, the virus IS still out there.

  21. The FSers are already having trouble winning support in Keene. Personally, I've tried to see some things your way … although most of the time I don't know what you want, except for the ability to intentionally break laws and then get all bent when you're held accountable.

    If you pursue the "rack attack," you will further risk losing the hearts and minds of the public.

  22. This discussion is so bizarre. Why ppl in the us are so afraid of nudity or "dirty" words is not something i can relate to.

    This also happen to be one reason why am having a hard time to decide if i want to move to new hampshire or not. 😐

  23. Apparently, "Brad" is not from Keene, and, he missed the "Walk a Mile in Her Shoes" event a while back…And, the "Take back the Night" protests of the last few years…And, although it's a bit tangential, "Men Who Cook" is another very popular, very sexist attraction here in Keene. Women exposing their breasts, just like *men* do? Sure. Why not. It's family oriented. How many families do you know, with breast-less women? None, I bet. So, this could appeal to all families. Look at the splash it caused in Brattleboro a while back. So, a piece of plastic the size of a nipple, placed on the nipple, that looks like a nipple itself, *IS* the difference between *legal* & *non-legal*….(merci beacoup, jraxis…)……Hmmmmm, I like that idea. I bet I can find a 3"(inch) piece of plastic the size of my penis…Is it OK if my buns go "Au Natural"???….THE NAKED PEOPLE OF KEENE ARE HERE! YOO-HOO! The Mothership can't be long now, foolks!…///"rack attack" yourself, assholebrad…or do you prefer "Bradley"???…

  24. break laws and then get all bent when you’re held accountable

    brad, i here declare that if you eat oatmeal on a tuesday i will send a gang of armed thugs to hang you by your toes until your ears fall off.

    are you prepared to be "held accountable"? douchebag.

    oh, i forgot that i need a bunch of people to "pass" my declaration, at which point you become "accountable" because it's "law". and maybe some more procedures, but people not butt stupid like you get the idea.

  25. I'll bring sunscreen !

  26. When there are so many more important things to deal with, specifically the enemy within, this would seem the perfect thing to do to further marginalize your movement and make fools of yourselves.

    Go topless if you want, but please, there are people being tortured in jail right now, or having their property stolen from them by the government.

    There are plans in the works to control every aspect of your life.

    When the sh** hits the fan, no one is going to worry about who is topless and who isn't.

  27. What no erudite quotes yet from Mr Springer on what the New Hampshire Revised Statutes Annotated have to say on this? :')

  28. Sorry, Mr. Springer is about to fall into bed. Most likely topless as it's kind of hot and sticky.

  29. @"REALIST"

    If you think there are more important things to fix then why aren't you fixing them already?

    Can you try to fix more than one thing at a time? Or is there some kind of rule against that?

  30. Oh my god! They are just breasts people. Of course, we have to protect the children! Little Billy can't be aware of his own penis until eighth grade health class. Yea, the whole thing seem silly to me too. However, it's even sillier that we live in a society embarrassed to death by their own freaking bodies. Is my mom a sex offender because i found her dildo when I was nine?

  31. I was following this and willing to be supportive but basically feeling uninspired about it until I started hearing all the sexist remarks in the forum and and a few here. That put a fire in me about this controversy and made it very clear which side I wanted to be on.

    Using the word "prude" is a mistake, I think. Most of the remarks I've heard, even from liberty-lovers, come down to sexism, i.e. it's okay for men to go topless but not women followed by some really contrived excuses for their sexism. If someone was saying no one should go topless, then that would be prudishness, but that's yet to be the case as far as I can tell.

  32. Wowza. Who knew…

  33. The irony is, liberty guys have been bitching for decades about the lack of women in the movement. Now a few of them show up in Keene, New Hampshire, decide to do this as their activism, and all of a sudden they are a liability? Sad.

    I don't think it's "all of a sudden they're a liability." Rather, if they're coming up with a "bad" idea for activism that's either detrimental or pointless, then they are in fact a liability. While I am a woman and daily oppressed by a law that prohibits me from doing something I already would not do, And I am not convinced of the idea being a "good" one, I'm open to be convinced that it would be a good to do. Hell, I want to be convinced that it's a great idea even though I could not do it myself.

    But what is wrong with an idea for activism undergoing serious scrutiny before it's carried out? Because it's a woman's idea, everyone should treat the idea with intellectual kid gloves? Because it's a woman's idea, people should not vent their concerns or take their own direct action to show they do not support it (cancelling subscription, removing ads, et al)? How condescending and sexist.

  34. As I have stated before… even though I disagree on this and will not take part in this ONE protest, I don't stand in the way of those that plan to do this.

    Have fun with it ladies and gents.

  35. This is not responsible blogging. Common decency calls for having a warning notice on the main part of the blog and the topless women after the jump.

  36. Keith,

    As has been mentioned multiple times, the girls in the photo are not topless – those are pasties. Look closer.

  37. Aw, let us have their fun. Liberty and Just-tits for all!

    And Keith, the attractive girls are wearing pasties. As a lesbian trapped in a male body, if you don't like 'em, go join a monastery. Nothing to be ashamed of in what God gave ya.

  38. In my hometown of Kingston, Ontario it is currently legal for women to walk around topless. It happens downtown on a rare occassion but I have seen it. The women protested for a whole summer walking around topless downtown until the city gave in and just said screw it.

    Edit: Apparently it's legal in all of Ontario to be topless.

  39. Regarding NSFWness:

    "Don't worry, boss, these girls are wearing pasties so we're all good, right?"

  40. This is not responsible blogging. Common decency calls for having a warning notice on the main part of the blog and the almost topless women after the jump. You have broken standard, voluntary common decency.

    This has set the Free Keene blog back more than any other story that has ever been covered here.

  41. Obviously photoshopped.

    Nobody wears Heidi braids any more.

  42. That dude behind them is at least a c-cup and yet he wouldn't even require pasties or a warning notice if he took his shirt off.

  43. I think all women should be required to wear burkas.

    Maybe one of the people at the event could wear one with a sign that reads "Would you prefer women wore this?"

    I won't encourage os discourage anyone for this. It's up to the women who are being discriminated against to decide.

  44. Ladies, I think we should get together and plan a protest where all the men go without pants. 🙂

  45. Last night or whenever Ann said:

    'The porcine aspect of Ian’s personality seems to be rearing its ugly head, as he once again reveals the adolescent prism through which he views women, i.e., as sex objects. Ever wonder why there’s only a shrine of FEMALE listeners on the FTL site? Because we all know that the most important thing about women is being able to look at them! And of course there are all sorts of protests a group of women could undertake to publicize why women’s concerns can be particularly well-met by adopting the principles of the so-called “liberty” movement. But the protest under consideration is the one that’s most satisfying to the 13 year-old male mindset: get some women to show their breasts! Anybody surprised?'

    Ann, I think this comment was personally insulting, not only to Ian, but also to his lady friend Julia. Do you think she would tolerate a man of the type you so vividly describe above? Do you even know Julia? Because you might as well have characterized her as some empty headed slut who trots along behind Ian all day with her head up his ass. Bad form, Ann, and I think YOU came in juvenile there.

    Keith, settle down, man, they're breasts. Most females have them, all of us have seen them, they occur naturally and do harm to no one simply by being present.

    Thank You

  46. bOObies!

    OK, now that that's out of the way…

    Here's what I see in this debate. I see the people who are voicing an opinion in the negative as simply saying 'I want you to be free to do what you want to do so long as I want to let you do it'

    We will not gain liberty for ourselves until we're willing to grant it to others.

  47. LP,

    Unfortunately, there are plenty of women who, as a result of self-loathing, involve themselves with men who are sexist and even abusive. Indeed, our society encourages this in countless forms. So the scenario you describe is, sadly, not unusual. Although characterizing this woman as "some empty headed slut who trots along behind Ian all day with her head up his ass" was not only unkind, it was a wild exaggeration; it is manifestly true that even accomplished, intelligent women can get involved in destructive relationships.

    Ann

  48. dancin machine

  49. Tell me in 25 words or less, Ann:

    Why do you read this website?

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