Keene Police Officer Joshua English Cleared in Fatal Shooting

Based on what little I know, it sounds to me that Officer English did the absolute right thing in this situation.  It is sad that a human has been killed…  but protection services, public or otherwise, will have to use deadly force from time-to-time to protect innocent human life.

This is the type of thing that police should be doing: protecting people from malum in se.

To those who would question the decision to fire the fatal shot right after a hostage negotiator has arrived I would say this: situations change very quickly.  Were I in Officer English’s shoes…  my priority would not be trying to resolve the situation without the deceased getting hurt.  My priority would be trying to resolve the situation without the person the deceased was threatening to kill getting hurt.  If that means killing the offender while a team of hostage negotiators gather outside, enter the room, or beg me to have a chance to talk the offender down, so be it.  I would have fired too.

I will snoop around and see if I can find a copy of the actual Attorney General report.

Article here.

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14 Comments

  1. English seemed ok when i had interactions with him .

    He provided a contrast to Tenny Jr who should be in jail and IS corrupted .

    Deadly force is used too often and people skills are not used often enough.

    Go to copblock.org and see .

    We have corrupt cops using abusive force toward the people they are suppose to "protect and serve".

    I always think how would it have turned out if he hadn't had that gun ,he is so ready to use, on his hip.

    People skills and reason.

    That lady cop in vt not too long ago didn't feel the need to KILL she shot in the guys' HAND.

    Cops overuse force and deadly force.

    This is why we the "protected and 'served'" need things like copblock.org.

  2. To ME people accept the death of a person ,TOO OFTEN, as a acceptable outcome.

  3. cops are excessive and abusive with there positions ,which puts all they do in question.

    Sort of like the liar who asks you to believe them THIS time.

  4. Deadly force is used too often and people skills are not used often enough.

    I completely agree with you.

    To ME people accept the death of a person ,TOO OFTEN, as a acceptable outcome.

    The police absolutely were not the initial aggressors in this situation. They were responding to aggression… extreme aggression.

    In my humble opinion a person forfeits their right to not have a bullet put through their head the moment they threaten to kill or seriously injure another person with a weapon.

    Would it have been preferable to arrest this guy without killing him? Sure.

    Should Officer English have risked the safety of the victim so that a better chance could have existed to take the guy alive? Absolutely not.

    Using deadly force can be traumatic for an officer… most human beings are not able to cope well with taking another life.

    That is GOOD police work. If that is all the police did, protect people from aggression of others, there would be no Free State Project.

    I say if anyone sees Officer English that they should shake his hand and thank him for protecting someone from a violent offender.

  5. While the use of violence in any situation is regrettable, the decedent was clearly the aggressor in this case, and the high likelihood of grievous bodily injury and/or death to the innocent party was justification to use deadly force in response to the initiation of force. This is one of the very few situations where violence can be used to solve a problem; that being the immediate defense of an innocent life that has been placed in jeopardy. A very unfortunate situation all-around. I hope that all of the involved parties have been able to cope with the emotional trauma of the event.

  6. If the police were better at self policing and calling out the subway shooters and the cop who shot the guy whittling in Seattle.
    And countless others.
    I'd be more inclined to give them credit where ,perhaps, credit is due.
    IF credit is due.
    They made their corrupt bed they will lay in it .
    There are PLENTY who say "the cops are great they do so good " then they say to those who have had a bad experience "you are wrong that didn't happen"..
    .NO ONE AFFIRMS the bad cop scenario except say people in the ghetto or low income places or in jail.
    Or small voices like copblock.org and FreeTalklive.com and others,I'm told.
    My voice will be on the side of the people who are getting the shit.
    Plenty of others will take the other position .
    peace
    Cops don't get the benefit of the doubt from me:they don't deserve it .

  7. this i what i say to the cops..call out your bad cops…quit because of your bad cops..CALL OUT LOUDLY AND REPEATEDLY ABOUT YOUR BAD COPS..OVER AND OVER AND OVER ….loudly and repeatedly …… and don't stop till the cops can be the moral beings they SHOULD BE!

    If YOU good cop are not SPEAKING OUT LOUDLY AND REPEATEDLY ABOUT YOUR BAD COPS YOU ARE AS BAD AS THEY ARE ; YOU ARE GUILTY OF WHAT THEY,THE BAD ONES, DO.

    thats it im done with my impotent rantings.

    peace out

  8. Speaking your mind is welcome here David. Thanks for participating!

    w00d: couldn't agree with you more.

  9. Nice try, Jardis. It didn't say so in the Sentinel story, but did you know that the dead guys' "victim" was his wife, and that 2 weeks after the shooting, she commited suicide???… I'm not saying that the guy didn't deserve to be shot, but it's bullshit that the cops have so few real "tools", and that most of their "tools' are actually *WEAPONS*…Just like Wayne Martin in Concord. ….do something on *THAT* story, OK, Jardis???…(I do like to see your "thin blue line" pop out from time to time on here!…~tKoK.

  10. BTW: Also named in the AG's report is Officer Corrigan. KPD Officer Corrigan showed up at one of the earliest "Nightcaps", and he was pretty decent. He actually talked, and listened, to several Liberty lovers. Corrigan also coaches youth athletics. he's a decent guy. Too bad Mr. Turcotte didn't get less AR-14 from English, and more negotiation from Corrigan…..Also, the Sentinel won't print the words "suicide by cop" even in an editorial, but that's what this case looks just like. "Suicide-by-Cop" is probably the most certain method of suicide there is…Also, correction: It was the guys' (ex)girlfriend he was holding hostage. And, yes, 2 weeks later she did commit suicide…Very sad all the way around…

  11. Nice try, Jardis. It didn’t say so in the Sentinel story, but did you know that the dead guys’ “victim” was his wife, and that 2 weeks after the shooting, she commited suicide???…

    No sir, I didn't know that. That is terribly sad.

    I’m not saying that the guy didn’t deserve to be shot, but it’s bullshit that the cops have so few real “tools”, and that most of their “tools’ are actually *WEAPONS*…

    I hear ya. In such a life-and-death situation, even if the police did have "less-than-lethal" tools, I'd still want them to use deadly force. This isn't because I'm a masochistic madman… it is because I have experience with "less-than-lethal" police weaponry and know for certain that they are not always effective. Deadly force generally is. If there is a situation where an offender has a knife to the throat of a victim, that is a situation were milliseconds count.

    Just like Wayne Martin in Concord. ….do something on *THAT* story, OK, Jardis???…(I do like to see your “thin blue line” pop out from time to time on here!…~tKoK.

    My "thin blue line" eh? 🙂 Well, I will say this. I absolutely will support the police in a situation where:

    1) They are not the initial aggressor,

    2) They use force to protect either a person or that persons property from the aggression of others; and

    3) The force used by the police was the minimal force required to neutralize the aggression.

    Say for-instance the police were raiding a house because someone was growing an unauthorized plant. The police enter the house, a home owner raises a weapon to defend himself, the police kill him. I absolutely would not support the police because they would fail #1 above.

    BTW: Also named in the AG’s report is Officer Corrigan. KPD Officer Corrigan showed up at one of the earliest “Nightcaps”, and he was pretty decent. He actually talked, and listened, to several Liberty lovers. Corrigan also coaches youth athletics. he’s a decent guy. Too bad Mr. Turcotte didn’t get less AR-14 from English, and more negotiation from Corrigan…..

    I've heard of Officer Corrigan and similarly heard positive reviews on him. I completely agree with you that it would have been preferable to have had this situation end without anyone getting hurt… but I think that it is unfair of you to ding Officer English's choice to use deadly force to protect someone simply because Officer Corrigan is more personable. Can you really say with certainty that Officer Corrigan wouldn't have done the same thing?

    I'll say again, I'm sad someone died as a result of the police encounter… but the second someone threatens to kill another person with a deadly weapon AND has the means and opportunity to carry out that threat, they've forfeited their right to not have extreme force used on them.

    Also, the Sentinel won’t print the words “suicide by cop” even in an editorial, but that’s what this case looks just like. “Suicide-by-Cop” is probably the most certain method of suicide there is…Also, correction: It was the guys’ (ex)girlfriend he was holding hostage. And, yes, 2 weeks later she did commit suicide…Very sad all the way around…

    You're probably right. Even if it was a suicide-by-cop, the police still were not the initial aggressor.

    Say a police officer was walking down the street and a random person whipped out a gun and pointed it at them. Were the police to kill that person, I'd support the police. They were not the initial aggressor and they were just defending themselves.

  12. In my experience, Officer English and some other Keene Officers have a "Cowboy" mentality and all too often lead with their guns.

  13. In my experience, Officer English and some other Keene Officers have a “Cowboy” mentality and all too often lead with their guns.

    Well, if the news story is accurate, it sounds like they responded with their guns. If a person has a knife, has threatened to use it on someone, and is in close proximity to them… I personally would prefer the police to lead with their guns.

    Wasting time trying to talk someone down in a situation like that could mean a knife in the throat of a victim.

    If this guy didn't want to get shot, he would have dropped the knife and surrendered. As tKoK pointed out, this guy wanted to die.

  14. The Keene Police Officers that I am referring to, lead with their guns even in situations involving apparently unarmed subjects. Let's not just "blame the dead guy". Did anyone hear him say he wanted to die? Maybe he was just so emotionally disturbed that he felt this was the only way to get the help he needed. We will never know…..

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